ok i see the test in 2003 on a ranger vs a druid. is this what you used to compare ?

If so, im just wondering how you compared the ranger in that test, using a 99% qual bow, with an effective dps of 16.0, which means the condition was prob down a %, and that he used light arrows, to not do as much damage, so he could get more hits in. When on your test with the armsman. using mp bow, and the highest bolt. which isnt that -15% damage on the lowest arrow that he used and +25% on the highest bolt you used ? Did i look at the wrong one your comparing ?

Some ppl posting in this thread directly or indirectly constantly imply, that one's opinion isn't worth much, if he hasn't played to his/her RR.

And obviously these higher RR players know a lot more than yourself about the class, that you are playing.
So Rangers: stop QQing and STFU or what are these people trying to say?

I only want to remind all of us, that arrogance and ignorance are rather bad consultants.

Fresa.

P.s.: I don't know, if bow-dmg should be as high, as it had been on live-servers prior to the archery patch in the old system. People on Uthgard have lower hps. We as archers should take note of that.
So imo we need a system here, that will have a bit lower dmg than on live in that times(viper3 ought to be treated imo in the same way), but considerable high enough archery dmg to make it a viable spec.
And first of all:
We need the mechanics restored like being able to firing critshot in a row, get rid of the toggle button.

That leads me to the next question:

What would be needed to make archery viable?

Imo being able to snipe successfully on casters. The only archetype we should be able to drop with bow only.
The latest change to castspeed has helped bring out more casters into RVR. What is good for the prey is good for the predator. So cheers about casters finally being more effective in RVR. Question here: was it already enough? The Staff will have the answer.

Let's forget about DI here. Everyone that attacks a grp with DI up and running faces the problem as a solo attacking one of the grpmembers, that he can't succeed no matter what. That has to be accepted, since it is a grp-RA, that is well appreciated and good for 8vs8 purposes to have a fun fight.

So how can an archer be successful against a caster?
From my experience only if the archer can do his job within 3-4 shots fired on the caster: first will go into self-bt, 2nd should be a crit, then two normal bow shots.

And quite frankly when painting this scenario, we must be talking about a fully buffed caster in a grp(DI here the exception, as is guard by a shield-tank, and pulsing bladeturn). Everything else would be pointless, because you can count the number of the solo casters, that run arround in RVR, on one hand.
If the healers of that grp cannot keep the caster alive then or the rest of the grp interrupt or make the archer flee, the caster definetly deserves to die and the archer ought to be rewarded with the rps.

Archery dmg should be orientated according to that scenario imo.
Missing arrows, like it occurs all too frequently even now with self-made arrows, is a great issue here. An archer needs reliability, that the few arrows, he can shoot at the target, before it either gets healed, he gets interrupted or the target runs away, actually hit the target.
Then the critshot-toggle-button, we had that already.

Fresa.

I may only be a rr4 ranger on uthgard, but uthgard isnt the only server i played a ranger on. And when i need some advice about the ranger, i ask my friend silverleaf, who had a live ranger, during toa days of rr8 or 9, and who also had a rr8 ranger on purga, when we played there.

And i understand what you mean by people having less HP here, but that is vs solo. Anyone with a rr or experenced, will have a str/con and con buffs some how, ether charge or in a group. Which then there health will be alot higher. Higher bow damage maybe good agenst unbuffed players and low con players, but when in a grp fight , like keep defense or offense, you be hitting your enemys for nothing, compared to there health. If you want lower bow damage to compensate for low hp, then you better lower AF, ABS, resists and so on. So your saying bow damage on classic was higher then this. The lack of buffbots, shouldnt nerf bow damage i think.

Pookies wrote:Hello everyone,

First post have to say I agree with thread starter and swift.

Ive actually stopwatched the average time for each class listed at 50 to kill me..at full health at lvl 49 with buffs
Me myself, as Pookies with starting points from the character creation all in dex up to where it had 1 left sitting now at 49 a total of 337dex(buffed) aug dex 2 and falcon's eye 4.. at lvl 49 with mp lvl 51 5.5 bow and fully sc templated gear 48 into pathfinding can only add/assist on people already being attacked by realm mates.. I could never kill anyone by myself..I wait patient at hmg and wait till a battle brews and leech which is all im good for.

I even respecd out of melee after not being able to shoot and then melee people down..hybrid style never once was I successful with lvl 51 99% weapons fully sc'd now at full bow its worse then before, realizing that bow was.. purposely turned down or nerfed as some like to say I rolled another ranger..

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA now rangers say that they add because they have bad armor, bad weapons, rr and what more?
Im sure that when bow damage will be fixed, and all what you want, you all will still do adding mode. Do you know who is Serenidade? He never added and he was rr4 too.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Realm_versus_Realm

Origin
In 2001, Mythic Entertainment introduced a new team-based form of PvP combat with the release of Dark Age of Camelot and called it Realm versus Realm. In RvR, players of each realm team up to fight against players from the opposing realms in team-based combat. This can include normal skirmishes between rival groups that is common in other PvP systems, but also consists of objective-based battles such as taking and holding keeps or capturing enemy relics.

The next person that complains about adds, im going to poke there eyes out lol. Get use to RvR. Yes i hate when someone adds on me, but its just part of the game. Learn to watch your back and know when to retreat or throw your hands up and give up lol.

Eclipsed wrote:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Realm_versus_Realm

Origin
In 2001, Mythic Entertainment introduced a new team-based form of PvP combat with the release of Dark Age of Camelot and called it Realm versus Realm. In RvR, players of each realm team up to fight against players from the opposing realms in team-based combat. This can include normal skirmishes between rival groups that is common in other PvP systems, but also consists of objective-based battles such as taking and holding keeps or capturing enemy relics.

The next person that complains about adds, im going to poke there eyes out lol. Get use to RvR. Yes i hate when someone adds on me, but its just part of the game. Learn to watch your back and know when to retreat or throw your hands up and give up lol.

It's about giving others a chance so they don't log out, lol. Don't your get this?

If you wanna brainlessly add everything, go ahead, but dont come crying when u can't find incs anymore.

Zarkor do you at least have a stealther? what are you doing in this topic? NON-Stealther classes have nothing to do with SOLO TOPICS, because they are meant to play grouped, so get going and play with your grp, there was NO INTENDED balance between stealtehrs and solo class chars. If bow is not working properly (tho zip prooved that it does) lets let other things that work alone, and fix bugs or other bad implemented issues.

quoting wikipedia muhaha...

The main bane for archer vs caster at the present is physical defense. It basically makes it like hitting a full chain wearer (sometimes even worse than chain if af buff is on). Without physical defense, casters would be viable squishy targets so to speak. At present, the best target for an archer is (ironically) an assassin. Maybe making arrows ignore physical defense could make this a viable arch type vs arch type scenerio.

I was a hybrid spec - bit of everything.

Then i noticed that i can use Pots and Charges, so i specced out of most of my Buffline.

Then i noticed my Bowskill has no big influence on the outcome of a fight, so i specced out of it.

What does this leave?
Right, enough points in stealth for not to be seen and the rest goes to melee.
And thats what you see at the moment: more and more Rangers and they are all heavy melee spec because Buffline and Archery are only worth a few points.

If i had Buffs in my Buff-Line i could not get from Pots and Charges, i would put more points in my Buff-Line. But right now, most Assasins i kill drop more green Lines than i do, because they just use Charges and Potions to get the same or even better Buffs than me - hate that.
Thers 4 Buff:
- Dex/Qui: can be charged and does not stack and i would have to spec all the way to 48 to get a better Buff than from the Charge.
- AF: Can be Charged, better than mine and does not stack
- Str: Can be Charged and does not stack
- Damage Add: Can be Charged, does not stack and the Charge with 11,3 DPS is better than the best Buff i can get in my Buffline at 46: 9,4 DPS.

I have 12 bow now, thats autotrain level. Right now i feel every point above that is a wasted point i would be missing somewhere else.
I do not even get the range bonus for elevated positions, so melee is most of the time a better choice, even on Casters.
- When i start shooting a caster with my bow i get QC-Mezzed and then nuked or petspammed to hell, even if i purge. Bow is not an otion, because i get interrupted.
- When i melee a caster, he cannot interrupt me and i usualy kill him unless its a Spritmaster with bugged intercept Pet or a MoC-Lifetapper.

So how stupid would i be to put more than my autotrained 12 points in bow?

EDIT: And Zippity, i dont care how much PD Casters have, i can melee them down easily, it just takes 2 swings more with high PD. But i can't shoot them down. Instead they kill me with range, but thats got nothing to do with PD.

I'm talking about taking out grouped casters when a fight is ongoing with another group/zerg or whatever, but yea MOC life tap casters and spiritmasters are pretty much off limits by anyone with half a brain.

Runis wrote:Zarkor do you at least have a stealther? what are you doing in this topic? NON-Stealther classes have nothing to do with SOLO TOPICS, because they are meant to play grouped, so get going and play with your grp, there was NO INTENDED balance between stealtehrs and solo class chars. If bow is not working properly (tho zip prooved that it does) lets let other things that work alone, and fix bugs or other bad implemented issues.

Lol I don't have a stealther at lvl 50 yet I manage to make posts with way more contribution to this thread than yours.

So you see it doesn't matter whether I have one or not, it's what you post that matters.


Most of the time I read ur posts it's either childish or just ridiculous, one might wonder how old u actaully are. However unlike you I rather stay on topic and therefore I apologise for this small deviation.

I'll speak on the subject when I reach 50. I'll probably suck irregardless due to lack of charge items.