Sendnudez wrote:We last heard from Thoughtseize when he lost his Cloudsong: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Opl77bP7vbY

Ahahahahahahahahahahaha )

i rather have a 80people zerg have fun zerging around, than a FG of 8 people farming noobs all nights

one makes 80players happy and playing in RvR, the other only 8

It's easy whats healthy for the server, and with more zerg...maybe melee grps will not be the easy-8man-roflstompcomp anymore and there will be more groups taking casters to zergfarm

Rasilaorc wrote:i rather have a 80people zerg have fun zerging around, than a FG of 8 people farming noobs all nights

one makes 80players happy and playing in RvR, the other only 8

It's easy whats healthy for the server, and with more zerg...maybe melee grps will not be the easy-8man-roflstompcomp anymore and there will be more groups taking casters to zergfarm

Not everybody in the zerg is happy and having fun. It's just that there are no other progressive options.

maybe our definitions of zergs are different...for me the random casual zerg is a huge bunch of players, some grouped, not all. Most don't have speed5, slowly weaving in one direction and the other, sometimes even in two direction at the same time because someone spotted someone else and ran after him ^^




if you have such zergs regularly then this zerg already opens LOTs of possibilities for all playstyle (minus 8vs8 preset combats) imo.
You don't like being part of that zerg? Well farm people trying to get to that zerg, because they like being in that zerg.
Oh, you're a fullgrp and are bored by farming solos/smallmans trying to get to the zerg? Well guerrillia fight the zerg. Extend it into a long line, crash into and kill the front and run away again.
You're not into kiting and extending? Well then lure them into a tower or wallhouse and bomb the ****** ****** out of all the idiots that actually try to get inside.


The only playstyle such a zerg doesn't support is having a pure 8vs8 fight against another group that also focused their setup fully on fighting another fullgroup.




And don't get me wrong, i love 8vs8 too...the longest (and most of the best) memories are from 8vs8 fights because they can really take long when two similarly skilled groups have a frontal inc. But that playstyle only features that playstyle. And in total, it even DISCOURAGES the other playstyles by berating them all the time about adds, zerging, and whatever just made your FG ******.




Tl;DR:


Zergs: benefit all playstyles but 8vs8


8vs8: benefit only 8vs8, through badmouthing even suppresses all other playstyles

@Rasilaorc

Have you actually played RvR on this server yet? That's not what happens at all. Zergs here consist of multiple 8 man groups. Not just a bunch of randoms all crawling across the frontier at a snail's pace.

You mention farming people trying to get to the zerg. That also doesn't happen here. These zergs are more organised than you give them credit. They are all together at all times and, like I said, consist of multiple 8 man groups (mostly). This means that each group will only ever run out when a) the other 7 members of the group are present, and b) whenever the zerg leader decides that it's time for the zerg to leave.

no i haven't im still grinding uphill towards 50
as i said, i guess our definitions of zerg are different then
if there are only coordinated stickgrps, then what happens is not what i described, you are correct.

But from a neutral point of view it seems when one realm runs with a 16man-group and kills 8mans, those 8mans are suddenly in the position that before belonged to the smallmen grps.


no matter how you turn it, all these arguments only make sense under the premise that "8vs8 is the right way to play daoc". If we, for a second, forget about that "rule" then all the complaints about zergs are mute.
And as old the saying is, imho it boils down to: "someone got killed in RvR", be it a smallmen stomping XPers, a PUG stomping the smallman, a 8vs8-grp stomping the PUG, a coordinated 16man stomping the 8man, a coordinated 24man stomping the 16man...etc...

You are right and you are wrong. There is no singular "correct" way to play the game. But this argument has a deeper meaning than that. This argument leads to people playing the game how the server setting dictates. Players want progression, so they join in with the only progressive thing that the server incentivises.

I wouldn't for a second say that zerging is a bad thing at all. My point is that there is nothing else to do. There are no incentives to RvR in any other way. Keeps are not rewarding, pve in rvr zones is not rewarding enough, soloing is not rewarding, zerging with lower numbers than your enemy is not rewarding, BGs are not rewarding. The server setting does not incentivise any other play style. The only thing this server has really made possible for us is to pve yourself silly. If you love grinding for hundreds of hours on the same mobs then this server is exactly what you need. Otherwise, well, see for yourself.

I look forward to speaking to you again when you are 50, templated and actively RvRing. Can I ask, what class are you playing and what level are you currently?


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agree with you there...somewhat

in the big picture you are correct...but soloing for example has never been done because it was the most efficient
and low RR people running as 16man isnt a uthgard thing neither


but i agree that we need other reasons for RvR to create more possibilities for non-setgrp players (fingerscrossed, cause i fear i won't find a set grp too fast)


PS: i'm a lvl34 sorc, and i am rather pessimistic about the future tbh seeing talk about zergs occuring more and more gives hope though, but if its just setgrps-grouping like you said....

no mid 8mans want a fair fight... 8v8 vs low rr groups with 5 relics is fair for these inbred baddies

or at LEAST exp for keep takes!!!! for the whole BG within 3000 units of the lord!!! Please ofc cap the xp out for lowbies so you can't just ding 1-10 in one keep take... but make it somewhat significant... like at level 49 you should get like half a bubble each keep, or a quarter bubble MINIMUM. Along with at minimum 500+ RPs for a 40+ and 1000 for a level 50. Preferably more, but this number will be fine, as long as there is SOME incentive besides relics. Relics are great and all, but some people only want to better their own character not the entire realm, hate to say it but that's just some people's mind set and this will fix all of that and encourage much casual and zerg warfare in the frontier.

Rasilaorc wrote:agree with you there...somewhat

in the big picture you are correct...but soloing for example has never been done because it was the most efficient
and low RR people running as 16man isnt a uthgard thing neither


but i agree that we need other reasons for RvR to create more possibilities for non-setgrp players (fingerscrossed, cause i fear i won't find a set grp too fast)


PS: i'm a lvl34 sorc, and i am rather pessimistic about the future tbh seeing talk about zergs occuring more and more gives hope though, but if its just setgrps-grouping like you said....

Zergs on this server are aids, especially as an Alb, because it's not the braindead bad classes with no speed and no gear that we had in 2002. It's just 8 mans on /stick running speed 6, which is nearly impossible to ever compete against unless you have a somewhat equally formidable zerg - and if you don't, your entire realm just logs for the night. It's like a king of the hill battle where you don't actually win anything. So I'm not sure why you are posting stuff promoting this if you are level 34 after 4 months.

Ensley03 wrote:

Rasilaorc wrote:agree with you there...somewhat

in the big picture you are correct...but soloing for example has never been done because it was the most efficient
and low RR people running as 16man isnt a uthgard thing neither


but i agree that we need other reasons for RvR to create more possibilities for non-setgrp players (fingerscrossed, cause i fear i won't find a set grp too fast)


PS: i'm a lvl34 sorc, and i am rather pessimistic about the future tbh seeing talk about zergs occuring more and more gives hope though, but if its just setgrps-grouping like you said....

Zergs on this server are aids, especially as an Alb, because it's not the braindead bad classes with no speed and no gear that we had in 2002. It's just 8 mans on /stick running speed 6, which is nearly impossible to ever compete against unless you have a somewhat equally formidable zerg - and if you don't, your entire realm just logs for the night. It's like a king of the hill battle where you don't actually win anything. So I'm not sure why you are posting stuff promoting this if you are level 34 after 4 months.

So, excatly what 8man do to Smallman and Smallman do to Solos? There will always be the side with lesser numbers that get steamrolled and log off. Only Problem with Zerg is, that 8man are not on the top of the foodchain anymore and for whatever reason 8mans are special.

As stated 100 times before, small mans should go to Alb, and the only person who will go there to zerg you down is Flump. Anyone who tries it in Emain is an idiot and is just going to add fights anyway, which is why they get ran over.

Ensley03 wrote:As stated 100 times before, small mans should go to Alb, and the only person who will go there to zerg you down is Flump. Anyone who tries it in Emain is an idiot and is just going to add fights anyway, which is why they get ran over.

Telling people what they have to play and/or where they have to play.

As i said: 8man are special for some reason Honestly, i would love to go to albion frontiers, but most of the time i get farmed by 8mans in front of sauvage. Maybe they missed the memo?

Why would you ever go in front of CS? lol