I've noticed a lot of new players, so I'd rather this discussion be kept to players who are very familiar with 1.65, having played it across multiple realms.

What are your thoughts on the state of RvR balance at this patch?

I noticed that, given the endurance situation in Albion, they will be at a disadvantage in long battles with endurance, generally having to rely on endurance pots in order to exclude the subpar Paladin.

I feel like Midgard melee groups will be strong in the beginning as the setup has a low skill floor. Once people get their templates, they will start to suffer against caster groups, being unable to get the quick 1-2 punch on casters.

Hib caster group in skilled hands will generally be best, their double group purge and NS giving them an edge over other groups.

What are your thoughts? Did you choose your realm based on its competitiveness?

Please keep this civil without the typical DAoC d*** measuring. Thank you.

Albion just have to roll with a pala. A good pala will do its job.
Stop playing paper Daoc. Good players are good players doesn't matter what character they play.

The zerg situation will be more interesting on a server with 3000+ players. Hope zerg will play smart and coordinated so the elitist have some hard time with the casual zerg. Problem is that lots of people will switch their brain of when they are together with a big group.

Pao wrote:Albion just have to roll with a pala. A good pala will do its job.
Stop playing paper Daoc. Good players are good players doesn't matter what character they play.

The zerg situation will be more interesting on a server with 3000+ players. Hope zerg will play smart and coordinated so the elitist have some hard time with the casual zerg. Problem is that lots of people will switch their brain of when they are together with a big group.

You're right about good players are good players and thats why they'll choose a better class to put into the limited group setup that alb has. Good players run efficient groups, paladins dont fit in. 1K endo range is a joke.

no serious group will run a paladin.

Pao wrote:Albion just have to roll with a pala. A good pala will do its job.
Stop playing paper Daoc. Good players are good players doesn't matter what character they play.

Agree with you regarding red text. However, you came into a thread about so-called paper DAoC to comment that people shouldn't play paper DAoC. Well, my friend, find another thread suitable to your interests then. No need to comment here.

Pao wrote:The zerg situation will be more interesting on a server with 3000+ players. Hope zerg will play smart and coordinated so the elitist have some hard time with the casual zerg. Problem is that lots of people will switch their brain of when they are together with a big group.

I doubt human nature is going to change, but certainly it will be interesting to have zergs again.

Isavyr wrote:

Pao wrote:Albion just have to roll with a pala. A good pala will do its job.
Stop playing paper Daoc. Good players are good players doesn't matter what character they play.

Agree with you regarding red text. However, you came into a thread about so-called paper DAoC to comment that people shouldn't play paper DAoC. Well, my friend, find another thread suitable to your interests then. No need to comment here.

Pao wrote:The zerg situation will be more interesting on a server with 3000+ players. Hope zerg will play smart and coordinated so the elitist have some hard time with the casual zerg. Problem is that lots of people will switch their brain of when they are together with a big group.

I doubt human nature is going to change, but certainly it will be interesting to have zergs again.

Paper Daoc is a good thing and its also fun but sometimes the meta crafting goes to far. A good group can run lots of setups even if they are sub optimal on paper.

I really hope we see all playstyles. solo vs. smallman vs. group vs. zerg. Thats will also even out the realm differences.

a good player is ever better on a good char...

But the thing doesn't add up. If you have a group of good players, then you are likely to get the most kick out of playing other groups of good players. If your performance ceiling is dictated by the setup you will play 8v7(1/2) at best, and that is a decided match from the start.

With this patch level you have to accept that 60% of the classes and specs are just theoretical balast. The ealier you know which side you are on the more fun you will have. Unless you enjoy playing with a handicap..

The realm with the most relicts will win. You cant compensate 20% bonus on fights that are usually very close. Also healing capacity is very limited with 1.65 so you will die in a lot of situations just because of relic bonus dmg that you can not outheal.

I agree that relic will have some impact, and do not forget the theoretical bonusses that held enemy keeps give.

In Uth 2.0 beta, my view on state of rvr was:

Low RR favors Mid. (i-stun/i-mezz/cele)

High RR favors Hib. (grp-Purge)

Really well played/coordinated groups favors Alb (SoS, Setups i dont wanna see more of so i dont call them out^^)

Zappo wrote:
Really well played/coordinated groups favors Alb (SoS, Setups i dont wanna see more of so i dont call them out^^)

I don't think you have to worry because players who generally can pull it off are already aware of the Alb comps. For sake of discussion, I'm curious which ones you are talking about. The split group (sorc/theurg/cab + melee) or the more body heavy group..

pweet wrote:The realm with the most relicts will win. You cant compensate 20% bonus on fights that are usually very close. Also healing capacity is very limited with 1.65 so you will die in a lot of situations just because of relic bonus dmg that you can not outheal.

Relics are stupid no question.. so leave them where they are if you want good fights.

Pao wrote:Albion just have to roll with a pala. A good pala will do its job.
Stop playing paper Daoc. Good players are good players doesn't matter what character they play.

Last time i checked being a good player didnt give you mezz/root immunity, theres only so much you can do to not be CCed as a PLD... its not that you can play at 2k range to avoid being rooted, your meleers are gonna need that ENDO, its the reason you have been invited.

Plus, id rather have people playing paper Daoc here in the forum than in game.

But back on topic: Midgard can put four classes together (heal, sham, skald, zerk) and make an efficient PUG, add a fifth (rune) and you got yourself a good balanced group with: more than enough CC, spec buffs, six casted resists, speed6, nearsight, aoe disease, dmg add, celerity and endo on everyone. On top of that, you get really strong melee damage on det tanks. Again, this is with FIVE classes.

Try to do the same on Hib.

Then try do the same on Alb.

Not complaining, just trying to be objective, im still going to play Alb or Hib because i like a challenge and i've been on Mid for too long, but the truth cant be denied and there's a reason if Midgard is FOTM. IT IS EASIER TO BUILD A DECENT GROUP.
Which means mid groups will spend less time waiting for an 8th at the PK and more time roaming, getting better and more confident, and most important having fun.

It also means there will be a lot more room for "second choice" classes in a Midgard PUG: once you have a 6/8 group made with 2 heals, 2 zerks, sham and skald you can very well invite a Thane or a BD or anything else really and still have a decent setup.

On the other hand Albion will have half of its rvr pop discussing the PLD matter rather than building groups. To invite or not to invite? That is the problem.
And once you finally have a PUG running, its mostly a caster group and much harder to play for an average group of players, especially if not everyone is on TS.

This does not apply to 8men, they got endo pots, they got TS, they got det tanks, they got the experience and know what to do, but keep in mind the vast majority of the current (amazingly high) population is made by puggers.

So theoretically, an optimized Alb 8 man... say caster group, an optimized Hib 8 man... say hybrid set up and an optimized Mid 8 man... say Zerk Pain Train all meet each other at the same time on equal footing... theoretically they are all RR5 and cap stats.

How does that fight go down?

We wouldn't play here if we knew the answer