So, wait, your argumentation is calling me a liar?

I've seen it, but I didn't ask both parties if they were fully templated or what their realm ranks were.

Please try not to be a dick, buddy. I know what I saw, and I've seen other classes take on friars without buffing themselves first. But that's all I saw, I didn't see their realm ranks floating above their heads, and I didn't see their resists and stats and specs.

Np, anytime.

Next time you might think before posting nonsense. You also didn't say if they were the same level. Or maybe one was afk? So many questions! So little sense.

As for the dick part, it's good to see some people don't even have to try.


And the rest of your post is also nonsense. Testing will amount to nothing in this case except more worthless numbers (and thank God we have enough of that in this topic). Might as well ask for "tests" in the OF vs NF topic.


Edit:
Oh and I just noticed your proposed method of testing: So find some people and duel them, and then use the results of the duel as proof? ROFL.

How about using normal server everyday RvR as proof then, instead basing a descision on a single persons ability or inability to win in a duel? Jesus.

Or here's another idea, I'll duel Eclipsed on my Friar, and whoever wins gets to decide what's gonna happen with buffpots on the server. That sound good?

"How about using normal server everyday RvR as proof then, instead basing a descision on a single persons ability or inability to win in a duel? Jesus."

Look, I didn't say it was totally 100% viable or ultimately deciding anything. You also assume that I think that Eclipsed will lose.

Now, you suggest using everyday RvR to see this, but how the hell do we use that if I'm trying to find out what the effect of buffs on fights against self buffers does?

Now, as for the results, if he fights them unbuffed and wins every time, and then fights them buffed in the second session, and the fights are more even, wouldn't that help your case? and on the other hand, if he loses every single time, it might just be inconclusive since nothing changed and it could have just been him sucking.

"And the rest of your post is also nonsense. Testing will amount to nothing in this case except more worthless numbers (and thank God we have enough of that in this topic). Might as well ask for "tests" in the OF vs NF topic"

Worthless numbers? Such as the closest thing we can get to 'field testing' a class being overpowered? Actually finding out if the supposed overpowered classes are ACTUALLY OVERPOWERED? To see if there is ANY basis to say that unbuffed classes need self buffs to compete with self buffers?

Is it really that absurd to ask people with self buffs to help test this? Obviously, comparing weaponskills/HP is going to get us nowhere as those aren't the only thing to consider, but actually SEEING if a class is overpowered is nonsense?

What the hell do you propose I do? Say "Oh, okay, I guess self-buffers are really actually overpowered, despite having no evidence to the contrary, other than people saying 'oh well from my experience, self-buffers are overpowered and I have to have self buffs to fight them"

I didn't JUST ask for eclipsed to do these tests, I suggested anyone with a self buffer to do it, as obviously tests have more footing with more numbers. I'm not asking for a million duels or fighting every player on the server, just some sort of basis for these claims of self-buffers being too strong.

All you're doing is saying "Oh everything you're saying is a lie/nonsense"

You make no effort to actually try and reason things out, and honestly I'm having a hard time figuring out why I'm even bothering having any sort of discussion with you whatsoever.

Not really, no (on both counts). After all it's only been "today" for about 2 hours.

Oh I editted a real post over that one, so go at it with guns of shotting

First of all, the only thing I originally implied was a lie/nonsense is the friar bit, and that really is either a lie, nonsense, or some grave human error (no armor, no template, no weapon, afk player). In any case it has no place in a serious discussion, that's the only reason why I singled it out.

Second, duel tests don't lead anywhere, because they are decided by PLAYER SKILL, not numbers. This is not a "rangers are ovepowered" topic, this is a topic about a server-wide general change. You can't get usable numbers to support either decisions (you also make the mistake of thinking I assume any side will win/lose) by making players duel. Especially since both sides may wish to fake the duel to prove their point.

Third, I do have a suggestion: Do not remove buffpots. They are already nerfed, are classic, Uthgard RvR history supports their use, and by using that logic you should also remove regen and heal pots and DD charges.

That is my suggestion. There is no way to "test" this, it isn't a mathematical problem with a solution, it's a combination of common sense and RvR experience, and when the guy pushing for this change says something like "In DAoC every class should be able to kill every other class", then you can see that he is severely lacking in both departments.


P.S. You can agree that self-buffs only bring self-buff classes up to the level of unbuffed classes and still be against the removal of buffpots, I don't see why you think that is a conflict of opinion. After all, that is my position also. And now I bid you good night.

OH HEY COOL YOU ACTUALLY MADE A POST THAT MAKES SENSE KIND OF

P.S. You can agree that self-buffs only bring self-buff classes up to the level of unbuffed classes and still be against the removal of buffpots, I don't see why you think that is a conflict of opinion. After all, that is my position also. And now I bid you good night.

Fantastic, I hadn't realized there were other reasons for people enjoying buff pots. You've really opened my ignorant eyes.

However, right now, I'm only talking about this part of the buff pot balance. Balancing self-buffer's situation is just a piece of it, an important piece, but I've already addressed other reasons for buff pots to remain in the game.

However, for THIS argument, I am not using this as an ultimatum to remove buff pots.

"That is my suggestion. There is no way to "test" this, it isn't a mathematical problem with a solution, it's a combination of common sense and RvR experience, and when the guy pushing for this change says something like "In DAoC every class should be able to kill every other class", then you can see that he is severely lacking in both departments."

I'm sorry, but I haven't been RvRing for years. The extent of my experiences haven't pitted me up against many rangers or self buffers. And the times where I did, I was unbuffed and was still able to fight them. (This was on my minstrel) You like to cite RvR experience with the assumption that everybody has had the same experience as you.

Why don't you tell me? Instead of assuming that I know, or mocking me for not knowing, why don't you tell me how self buffers perform on the open field with other players having buffs? I've already pointed out that the disadvantage might be negligible - but it's there - and I don't know the extent. Why don't you enlighten me rather than telling me "Oh you just have to have general experience in RvR and it's so obvious!"

Secondly, common sense? Is it really common sense to say that just because a class can buff itself means that it'll kill everyone else?

"First of all, the only thing I originally implied was a lie/nonsense is the friar bit, and that really is either a lie, nonsense, or some grave human error (no armor, no template, no weapon, afk player). In any case it has no place in a serious discussion, that's the only reason why I singled it out."

What, do you play a goddamn Friar and are a god at duels and are untouchable? Or have you had your ass consistently kicked by Friars even with self buffs? I'm sorry if I don't have your glorious knowledge of how friars do when fighting unbuffed players, because I've never seen it outside of miscellaneous duels, but why don't you tell me?

"Second, duel tests don't lead anywhere, because they are decided by PLAYER SKILL, not numbers. This is not a "rangers are ovepowered" topic, this is a topic about a server-wide general change. You can't get usable numbers to support either decisions (you also make the mistake of thinking I assume any side will win/lose) by making players duel. Especially since both sides may wish to fake the duel to prove their point."

I didn't make that mistake. You edited your post to make yourself sound right. I obviously can't prove it, but honestly, what kind of crap is that? And do you think that random, even less controlled fights, in the frontiers are a more reliable way to judge anything? There are so many MORE variables, and so much more SKILL to consider. Yes, there's obviously riggability, but if you look at a log and fraps and see that one person is obviously doing something wrong, then that duel can be thrown out.

Now, I want to thank you for typing more than three condescending sentences to me, but at the same time, I want to punch you for -- Hold on, I just saw something else

Uthgard RvR history supports their use, and by using that logic you should also remove regen and heal pots and DD charges.

Those do have their own issues. But, as it stands, all classes can benefit from them in about the same way, unlike buff pots. There's a few exceptions, like all of these being much stronger in the hands of tanks, but that would take much different arguments and doesn't pertain much to this discussion. I wouldn't really be in favor of removing them, but I could sure as hell bring up good reasons.

"This is not a "rangers are ovepowered" topic..."

Yeah, it's not, but that's one very common argument against removal of buff pots. If this actually turns out to be true, that self-buffers are overpowered, then the entire argument, to me, is thrown out.

I'm honestly not steadfast against buff pots. I can live with them. Eclipsed should be able to as well. However, as long as it's being discussed, I want to at least try and help him, myself, and others come to a conclusion on the subject. Nayru and possibly other staff members may be talking about it right now, and not discussing it just because some people really really like having them, is to me, against the purpose of the forum.

I want to ask you, though, if you would be upset if buff pots were removed, and why.

Is it because you'd get rolled by self buffers all day?
Is it because you find fighting buffed players with buff players in solo more enjoyable?
Is it because you feel it will have an impact on 8v8?
Is it because you think it'll upset to many people?
Is it because you feel that they promote balance themselves, outside of fighting self-buffers?
Is it because you'd feel like the game is being cheapened/diluted by getting rid of them?

Honestly, I would think people wouldn't be so upset about not having to buy barrels/make barrels/buy recharge stones. But that's just me. What harm do you think would come if they were removed or made to be only used one at a time?

get two rangers with cap sc and same skillset. one with selfbuffs, the other with selfbuffs and potions.
see how big that difference is.

i duelled with a ame level, same rr ranger.


lurikeen pierce with 42 PF (him) vs shar blade with 31 PF(me)
PD3 on him,
PD1 and MOP2 on me.

and he utterly destroyed me every time.
my pots (str/con, haste, health) didnt help at all.

the only way i would win was staging a real combat situation, both stealthed. due to his higher PF he had lower stealth and i could open the fight with sidestun.
even then it was very very close, i won by 5% hp left (including taking a healthpot midfight).

the higher selfbuffs he had canceled out every bonus i had including pots.


so i skipped my skilling up plan and went straight for 42 pf before skilling anything else. and so far, the difference has been huge.

the increase in power from 32 to 42 PF is significant.
much more impact then the pots ever had.

That's what I like to see. Sounds interesting. The thing I notice though is that you pointed out that originally the duel wasn't mimicking a real combat situation, which is what I wanted.

However, I dunno about this example - you used two rangers. For a ranger, pathfinding is probably a better way to raise weaponskill than putting points in your weapon. But you didn't even actually say if you had a higher weapon spec.

"get two rangers with cap sc and same skillset. one with selfbuffs, the other with selfbuffs and potions."

Yeah, there isn't much of a benefit that rangers gain from the 2-3 pots they can use.

This really illustrates the fact that pathfinding definitely is potent, and it is more potent than buff pots (this was never really disputed), but it doesn't really answer the question of buff potted characters versus self-buffers, since what I see here is a weaker ranger versus a stronger one, due to a smarter spec.

And did you rematch the same guy? And you said the difference was huge, I'm guessing you meant that you were even with him at that point?

This definitely helps me look at the power of the pathfinding spec, would you mind also trying that with a couple other classes who are unbuffed?

well i have to say we both where lvl 42 3L2 at this point.

he was PF 42, stealth 18, piercing 34, CD18.
base stats lurikeen:
63 str, 40 con, 127 dex, 109 quick

+63 per stat from sc armor:
126 str, 103 con, 190 dex, 172 quick

with selfbuffs (base value * 25%):
177 str (+51), 103 con, 269 dex(+78), 250 quick (+78)

i was PF 31, Stealth 34, Blade 34, CD18.
base stats shar:
83 str, 90 con, 97 dex, 69 quick

+63 per stat from sc armor:
146 str, 153 con, 160 dex, 132 quick

with selfbuffs (base value * 25%):
186 str (+42), 153 con, 221 dex(+61), 193 quick (+61)

with 42 pf i could have had:
195 str, 153 con, 238 dex, 210 quick


bonus from potions: 30 str, 30 con, 13% haste
216 str (+72), 183 con (+30), 221 dex(+61), 193 quick (+63)

final direct comparison:
him: 177 str (+51), 103 con, 269 dex(+78), 250 quick (+78)
me: 216 str (+72), 183 con (+30), 221 dex(+61), 193 quick (+63)

WS stat him: 223 = 177 + 269 / 2
WS stat me: 216 (including 30 str from potion)

so basicly his WS was higher then mine even wihtout him using a dex or a str/con potion.
so he could push that quite a bit if he wanted.
still, there is an 50/80 con difference to my advantage, while he has a better chance to evade and a higher attack speed due to higher quick and faster weapons, which i counter with slower mainhand and dual swing haste affect + haste potion.
excat speed values can be calculatet if needed.

so while i went for stealth to get the jump on my targets he went for higher PF.

he used 3.1 speed on main and offhand.
i use 4.2 on main and 3.1 on offhand.

in a straight up non stealthed duel he would outdamaged me by far. that has to factor in his PD3 vs my PD1 and the different resist of reinforced armor vs slash/thrust.


still, due to my big lead in hitpoints i could soften that up a bit.


but you can see, race, choosen weapon and selfbuff values play a much bigger part then potions alone. plus his PD3 (and the armor resists) was really a big difference, he made offhand hits for 50 damage, while i only hit him for 30 on my offhand hits with the same delve damage and speed on that.



now, looked at it in real fights, i have the advantage over him against the same target. most of our targets give bonus to slash or are neutral, while he has mostly malus.
also, he is less likely to open a fight with the sidestun and has to rely on his after evade stun to get some more hits in.
also, on opening with a sidestun, i can start the glowing blade sidechain, which gives a bigger damage output due to my bladespec, while he can only use 1 sidestyle from his piercing line after an evade and aside from that, a medium damage anytime chain.

so all in all, due to my choice of race, weapontype, skillset and RA choice, in a headon battle against him (or high dex classes)i will lose.
in a real situation against an infiltrator or a shadowblade i will win out.

the benefit of the str/con pot is that my hitpoint buffer increases by about 80 points and my meele damage increase by 2-5 points per hit.
so the hitpoints i get from +30 con compensates very little for the lesser chance to evade.
over the duration of a regular fight the buff gives me 1 more low damage hit i can take and a bonus to damage equal to 1 offhand hit.


the most effective potionbuff i can get is haste.
and in most cases i save the money for the str/con and get a druid to cast AE buffs. or run wihtout.

overall i could use str/con, con, dex and haste to increase my performance.

dex is rather pointless for me since i use an offensive playstyle and dont benefit from dex.
higher quick would give me a better damge boost.
which you can only get by using a dex/quick potion which, with its value of 30, is far inferior (less then 50%) to the selfbuff you have even at 31 PF.

i dont use con potions as an additon because i dont need it in fight i would win anyway and fights i lose i wouldnt sruvive with the few more hitpoints.

it is very very rare for me to lose by that "one hit worth of hp",
since most of my targets have far lower base con then me anyway.

either i win big or i lose big.

as said before, potions only make a noticable difference if its a 2 vs 1.
then that additional little push might help you to kill at least one of them before they bring you down. thats the main reason for the str/con potion.
the haste potion i only use in that situation too. if i see that there is a second stealther about, i sip the haste.
in an one on one it would reduce my style damage too much, dragging the fight along. but without it, i wouldnt swing fast enough to destealth the second attacker before he can land his PA.
so normaly in low traffic times i run without potions, in high traffic times i buff both and remove the haste if i am sure to engage in an one on one.

and one PA is worth about 5 meele attacks - or more.
and thats 5 attacks i can dish out double the damage i recieve.
and that makes a difference.



all in all, if i use all potions available, i can take 1 medium damage hit more and do 1 offhand hit more damage. 2 offhand hits with haste.
and have a very slight higher chance to evade, which i rarely ever do.


lately i drifted away from str/con and haste and towards health reg, instant HP and endurance potions. since i upped my PF and the bonus from my SC and level increased, i found that decreasing the downtime between the fights is far more important then potions that would only give a minor buff in combat.
the in lower levels statts buffs where quite usefull, but for higher levels i consider the effects just to low to make a noticable difference in a short duration fight. much more usefull in pve.


for duels with other classes i would have to increase in RR and level a bit, since from the class most alike to rangers (bm) all my buddies are 49/50.

if i find someone on similar level/rr, i give it a go with him unbuffed and then buffed.

On the issue of grp vs grp and what effects it would have on them is, smarter and more unique grp battles. Instead of having what you want in a grp, youl have to choose, do you want extra healing, extra dmg or do you want your haste or dmg adds and so on buffs, since you cant use a pot or charge. If you want easy mode, play live where you get everything easyer, or do you want hardcore classic with more complete grps. Its up to you. Use your head and choose your grps smarter.

Now on this ranger vs ranger duel. I dont think it was a good duel, one yes he had more dex/qui, more str, more AF, and more DA, actualy.

17 more D/Q
9 more str
15 more AF
1.9 more DA

Now the diffrence isnt that great, what made you lose so much is that your using blades vs a ranger, who has 10% extra resist, while your pierc is neutral. Also no matter what race you pick, blades will still have less WS, then pierc. I figure the most WS youd have with 39+15 would be 1115 blade WS, while the same RR ranger with pierc and 42 PF and no pots would have 1131 pierc WS as a luri.

But what stops the 42 PF ranger from having the same pots too. You could use D/Q charge with lower PF, but the 31 PF DQ is 61 while the charge is 63, so you still are better of with yours, so to get full use of the DQ charge, youd have to drop PF even more, while losing your Str, AF, DA and speed.

All your duel proved is a shar blade ranger with less WS, vs a luri ranger with more pierc WS and 12% tier 2 resist and 10% more slash resist, would still do better. If you really want to test, fight a non buffer class , who doesnt use any buffs, while you use only PF and see if you totaly own him. And i think i may go looking to duel someone also, but im dont going to tell them why, im sure people are not going to want to help out removing there buffbonus that gives them an edge.

{ just notice you where lvl 42, and the above is based on if you where 50 }

Also, he had dimondback, and you could only side stun. How often did he get dimondback on you ? And remember uthgard is setup for lvl 50 when they do formulas, so game play at 50 is much diff then 42.

well if you dont tell them why there is a hitch.

the most likely char to duel with is a blademaster.
and if you just straight up duel with them, they will throw everything they have at you.

tripple wield will be the least of your worries, and you cant win that. ever.
also, since most BMs nowadys run with shield crosspec, chances for you to actually win without telling them what the duel is really about are next to nothing.


and even if they dont use any of their tools, its still not a real situation. its one thing to attack someone headon who knows your coming and to ambush someone who except something to attack him, but is unaware of what it will be and when it will come.


still, utulizing the rangers pros im pretty confident that it can win against most classes with the right RAs.

would be interesting to watch anyway.

Go for it Eclipsed, but I'd prefer if you saw what the fight is like if they're unbuffed. Let them use any RAs and use all the tools you have, but not pots.

On the statement vs a blademaster who is using triplewield. The best you can do as a ranger is ice storm him to stun, then quickly run to get some distance, if you think he will use charge, then you use your speed burst , if its up. After his triple wield is down, you can ether turn and fight, or stealth and get a shot or two in. Need to learn strats vs diff things. Ive also heard people use Desprate Bowman to counter such abilities, also if on live you could use Forceful Zepher or phase shift to counter also, but uthgard cuts those tools.

I also jumped on live to test out my theory on current live, with a ranger and a nigthshade. Same race, same stats, same specs, and everything simular. Exept the ranger has 50 PF/bow spec for max buffs, vs the NS max poisons.

First here is the char stats

Ranger
_______________________________
Str = 50 (62)
Dex/Qui = 72 (90)
AF = 80 (95)
DA = 9.4

Unbuffed Stats
AF = 553
WS = 931
HP = 1049

Unbuffed Stats w/ Poison Debuffs
AF = 553
WS = 697
HP = 905

Buffed Stats
AF = 648
WS = 1150
HP = 1049

Buffed Stats w/ Poison Debuff
AF = 648
WS = 860
HP = 905


Nightshade
______________________________
No Buffs

Unbuffed Stats
AF = 511
WS = 925
HP = 1049

Now i tryed to get both with same WS, but the Ranger ended up with +1 more pierc, but i didnt think it would make that great of a impact on this test.

First i tested Unbuffed Ranger vs Unbuffed NS with no Poisons. This is all unstyled, since its really hard to style two clients. The end result of the duel was that the NS won, mainly because of his higher evade.

Then i tested Unbuffed Ranger vs Unbuffed NS with ws/con debuff poison
The end result was the NS won by a long shot, with abotu 50% life left.

Then i tested Unbuffed Ranger vs Unbuffed NS with ws/con + 64dot Poison
The end result was the NS won by a even longer shot, like 70%. Was a fast fight.

Then i tested Buffed Ranger vs Unbuffed NS with ws/con+64 dot poison
The end result was about 50/50 with the NS wining by a hair.

I also tested that test with styles the best i could, with taunt on both, by moving my clients so i could hit both taunts over and over to make both do styles and end result was again 50/50.

Now i know this isnt going to convince anyone, i dont think anything would, but i thought it was intresting , since it was exactly how i expected it. That both classes using no features are equal, but give the assasin his debuffs and dots vs ranger without his buffs and he stands no chance, while if you give him his buffs, that some say would be OP, came out to balance him with the NS with his skills. I was suprised that the ranger had issues unbuffed vs NS without buffs and no poisons, because of his evade. But since they removed the duel wield bonus, the NS evades alot more. The ranger does also, but the NS gained more overall by that rule removel. So i suspect on uthgard it would of been equal.

Here is the chatlogs for each test. Yes there is variences when i tested, but genraly this is about what it comes to.

=============================================


*** Chat Log Opened: Sat Dec 05 02:38:11 2009

** UnBuffed Ranger vs UnBuffed NS w/o Poisons **

[02:38:22] You enter combat mode and target [Donnfhlaireal]
[02:38:22] Donnfhlaireal is too far away to attack!
[02:38:25] Donnfhlaireal is too far away to attack!
[02:38:28] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his rapier!
[02:38:28] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 95 damage.
[02:38:28] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his dirk!
[02:38:28] You evade Donnfhlaireal's attack!
[02:38:29] You attack Donnfhlaireal with your dirk and hit for 58 damage!
[02:38:30] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his rapier!
[02:38:30] You evade Donnfhlaireal's attack!
[02:38:30] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his dirk!
[02:38:30] You evade Donnfhlaireal's attack!
[02:38:30] Donnfhlaireal evades your attack!
[02:38:30] You attack Donnfhlaireal with your dirk and hit for 57 damage!
[02:38:32] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his rapier!
[02:38:32] Donnfhlaireal misses!
[02:38:32] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his dirk!
[02:38:32] Donnfhlaireal misses!
[02:38:32] Donnfhlaireal evades your attack!
[02:38:34] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his rapier!
[02:38:34] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 67 damage.
[02:38:34] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his dirk!
[02:38:34] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 57 damage.
[02:38:34] Donnfhlaireal evades your attack!
[02:38:36] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his rapier!
[02:38:36] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 60 damage.
[02:38:36] You attack Donnfhlaireal with your rapier and hit for 63 damage!
[02:38:36] You critical hit for an additional 13 damage!
[02:38:36] You attack Donnfhlaireal with your dirk and hit for 62 damage!
[02:38:38] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his rapier!
[02:38:38] You evade Donnfhlaireal's attack!
[02:38:38] Donnfhlaireal evades your attack!
[02:38:38] You miss!
[02:38:40] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his dirk!
[02:38:40] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 55 damage.
[02:38:40] You attack Donnfhlaireal with your rapier and hit for 65 damage!
[02:38:40] Donnfhlaireal evades your attack!
[02:38:42] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his rapier!
[02:38:42] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 53 damage.
[02:38:42] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his dirk!
[02:38:42] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 57 damage.
[02:38:42] Donnfhlaireal evades your attack!
[02:38:44] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his rapier!
[02:38:44] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 70 damage.
[02:38:45] You attack Donnfhlaireal with your rapier and hit for 68 damage!
[02:38:45] Donnfhlaireal evades your attack!
[02:38:46] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his dirk!
[02:38:46] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 58 damage.
[02:38:47] Donnfhlaireal evades your attack!
[02:38:47] You miss!
[02:38:48] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his rapier!
[02:38:48] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 68 damage.
[02:38:48] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his dirk!
[02:38:48] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 59 damage.
[02:38:49] You attack Donnfhlaireal with your rapier and hit for 78 damage!
[02:38:49] You attack Donnfhlaireal with your dirk and hit for 52 damage!
[02:38:50] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his rapier!
[02:38:50] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 68 damage.
[02:38:50] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his dirk!
[02:38:50] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 51 damage.
[02:38:51] You attack Donnfhlaireal with your dirk and hit for 67 damage!
[02:38:52] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his rapier!
[02:38:52] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 73 damage.
[02:38:52] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his dirk!
[02:38:52] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 48 damage.
[02:38:53] Donnfhlaireal evades your attack!
[02:38:54] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his rapier!
[02:38:54] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 55 damage.
[02:38:54] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his dirk!
[02:38:54] Donnfhlaireal misses!
[02:38:55] You attack Donnfhlaireal with your rapier and hit for 70 damage!
[02:38:55] Donnfhlaireal evades your attack!
[02:38:56] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his rapier!
[02:38:56] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 61 damage.
[02:38:57] Donnfhlaireal evades your attack!
[02:38:57] Donnfhlaireal evades your attack!
[02:38:58] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his rapier!
[02:38:58] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 91 damage.
[02:38:58] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his dirk!
[02:38:58] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 61 damage.
[02:38:58] You attack Donnfhlaireal with your dirk and hit for 70 damage!
[02:39:00] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his rapier!
[02:39:00] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 62 damage.
[02:39:00] Your duel ends!
[02:39:00] Finvachagen was just defeated in a duel by Donnfhlaireal!
[02:39:00] You have died. Type /release to return to your last bind point.
[02:39:00] Donnfhlaireal wins the duel!
[02:39:00] You died fighting for your realm and lose no experience!

** NS wins with 40% life left **

*** Chat Log Closed: Sat Dec 05 02:39:07 2009



*** Chat Log Opened: Sat Dec 05 02:56:04 2009

** UnBuffed Ranger vs UnBuffed NS w/ ws/con Debuff **

[02:56:07] You enter combat mode and target [Donnfhlaireal]
[02:56:07] Donnfhlaireal is too far away to attack!
[02:56:08] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his dirk!
[02:56:08] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 50 damage.
[02:56:09] You attack Donnfhlaireal with your rapier and hit for 76 damage!
[02:56:09] Donnfhlaireal evades your attack!
[02:56:10] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his rapier!
[02:56:10] You evade Donnfhlaireal's attack!
[02:56:10] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his dirk!
[02:56:10] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 62 damage.
[02:56:11] Donnfhlaireal evades your attack!
[02:56:12] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his rapier!
[02:56:12] Donnfhlaireal misses!
[02:56:12] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his dirk!
[02:56:12] You evade Donnfhlaireal's attack!
[02:56:13] You attack Donnfhlaireal with your rapier and hit for 73 damage!
[02:56:13] Donnfhlaireal evades your attack!
[02:56:14] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his rapier!
[02:56:14] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 70 damage.
[02:56:14] Your physical essence is weakened!
[02:56:14] Your Constitution has decreased.
[02:56:14] Your hits have decreased.
[02:56:14] Your physical essence is weakened!
[02:56:14] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his dirk!
[02:56:14] Donnfhlaireal misses!
[02:56:15] Donnfhlaireal evades your attack!
[02:56:15] You miss!
[02:56:16] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his rapier!
[02:56:16] You evade Donnfhlaireal's attack!
[02:56:16] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his dirk!
[02:56:16] You evade Donnfhlaireal's attack!
[02:56:17] Donnfhlaireal evades your attack!
[02:56:17] You attack Donnfhlaireal with your dirk and hit for 43 damage!
[02:56:17] You critical hit for an additional 10 damage!
[02:56:18] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his rapier!
[02:56:18] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 68 damage.
[02:56:18] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his dirk!
[02:56:18] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 57 damage.
[02:56:19] You attack Donnfhlaireal with your rapier and hit for 49 damage!
[02:56:20] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his dirk!
[02:56:20] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 45 damage.
[02:56:22] Donnfhlaireal evades your attack!
[02:56:22] You attack Donnfhlaireal with your dirk and hit for 50 damage!
[02:56:22] You critical hit for an additional 12 damage!
[02:56:22] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his rapier!
[02:56:22] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 65 damage.
[02:56:23] You miss!
[02:56:23] You attack Donnfhlaireal with your dirk and hit for 55 damage!
[02:56:24] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his dirk!
[02:56:24] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 48 damage.
[02:56:25] Donnfhlaireal evades your attack!
[02:56:25] Donnfhlaireal evades your attack!
[02:56:26] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his rapier!
[02:56:26] Donnfhlaireal misses!
[02:56:28] Donnfhlaireal evades your attack!
[02:56:28] Donnfhlaireal evades your attack!
[02:56:28] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his rapier!
[02:56:28] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 62 damage.
[02:56:28] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his dirk!
[02:56:28] Donnfhlaireal misses!
[02:56:30] You attack Donnfhlaireal with your rapier and hit for 46 damage!
[02:56:30] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his dirk!
[02:56:30] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 49 damage.
[02:56:32] Donnfhlaireal evades your attack!
[02:56:32] Donnfhlaireal evades your attack!
[02:56:32] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his rapier!
[02:56:32] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 81 damage.
[02:56:34] Donnfhlaireal evades your attack!
[02:56:34] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his dirk!
[02:56:34] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 54 damage.
[02:56:36] Donnfhlaireal evades your attack!
[02:56:36] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his rapier!
[02:56:36] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 56 damage.
[02:56:38] You attack Donnfhlaireal with your rapier and hit for 47 damage!
[02:56:38] Donnfhlaireal evades your attack!
[02:56:38] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his rapier!
[02:56:38] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 65 damage.
[02:56:38] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his dirk!
[02:56:38] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 57 damage.
[02:56:40] You attack Donnfhlaireal with your dirk and hit for 50 damage!
[02:56:40] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his rapier!
[02:56:40] You evade Donnfhlaireal's attack!
[02:56:40] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his dirk!
[02:56:40] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 46 damage.
[02:56:41] Donnfhlaireal evades your attack!
[02:56:42] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his dirk!
[02:56:42] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 66 damage.
[02:56:43] You attack Donnfhlaireal with your rapier and hit for 47 damage!
[02:56:44] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his rapier!
[02:56:44] You evade Donnfhlaireal's attack!
[02:56:45] You miss!
[02:56:46] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his rapier!
[02:56:46] You evade Donnfhlaireal's attack!
[02:56:46] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his dirk!
[02:56:46] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 52 damage.
[02:56:47] You attack Donnfhlaireal with your dirk and hit for 44 damage!
[02:56:48] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his dirk!
[02:56:48] Donnfhlaireal misses!
[02:56:49] You attack Donnfhlaireal with your rapier and hit for 57 damage!
[02:56:49] You attack Donnfhlaireal with your dirk and hit for 54 damage!
[02:56:50] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his dirk!
[02:56:50] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 49 damage.
[02:56:51] Donnfhlaireal evades your attack!
[02:56:52] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his rapier!
[02:56:52] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 62 damage.
[02:56:53] You attack Donnfhlaireal with your dirk and hit for 42 damage!
[02:56:54] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his rapier!
[02:56:54] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 54 damage.
[02:56:54] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his dirk!
[02:56:54] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 59 damage.
[02:56:55] Donnfhlaireal evades your attack!
[02:56:56] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his rapier!
[02:56:56] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 58 damage.
[02:56:56] Your duel ends!
[02:56:56] Your form is restored.
[02:56:56] Your Constitution has increased.
[02:56:56] Your hits have increased.
[02:56:56] Your form is restored.
[02:56:56] Finvachagen's form is restored.
[02:56:56] You have died. Type /release to return to your last bind point.
[02:56:56] Donnfhlaireal wins the duel!
[02:56:56] You died fighting for your realm and lose no experience!

** NS won with 50% life left **

*** Chat Log Closed: Sat Dec 05 02:57:03 2009



*** Chat Log Opened: Sat Dec 05 03:03:23 2009

** UnBuffed Ranger vs UnBuffed NS w/ ws/con Debuff + 64 Dot Poison **

[03:03:25] You enter combat mode and target [Donnfhlaireal]
[03:03:25] Donnfhlaireal is too far away to attack!
[03:03:27] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his rapier!
[03:03:28] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 61 damage.
[03:03:28] Your physical essence is weakened!
[03:03:28] Your Constitution has decreased.
[03:03:28] Your hits have decreased.
[03:03:28] Your physical essence is weakened!
[03:03:28] Donnfhlaireal evades your attack!
[03:03:28] Donnfhlaireal evades your attack!
[03:03:29] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his rapier!
[03:03:29] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 57 damage.
[03:03:30] You attack Donnfhlaireal with your rapier and hit for 47 damage!
[03:03:30] Donnfhlaireal evades your attack!
[03:03:31] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his rapier!
[03:03:31] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 73 damage.
[03:03:31] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his dirk!
[03:03:31] You evade Donnfhlaireal's attack!
[03:03:32] You attack Donnfhlaireal with your rapier and hit for 62 damage!
[03:03:32] Donnfhlaireal evades your attack!
[03:03:33] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his rapier!
[03:03:33] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 58 damage.
[03:03:34] Donnfhlaireal evades your attack!
[03:03:34] Donnfhlaireal evades your attack!
[03:03:35] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his rapier!
[03:03:35] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 74 damage.
[03:03:36] You attack Donnfhlaireal with your rapier and hit for 59 damage!
[03:03:36] Donnfhlaireal evades your attack!
[03:03:38] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his rapier!
[03:03:38] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 67 damage.
[03:03:38] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his dirk!
[03:03:38] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 49 damage.
[03:03:38] You are poisoned!
[03:03:38] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 72 damage.
[03:03:38] Donnfhlaireal evades your attack!
[03:03:40] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his rapier!
[03:03:40] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 76 damage.
[03:03:40] Donnfhlaireal evades your attack!
[03:03:41] You are poisoned!
[03:03:41] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 72 damage.
[03:03:41] You attack Donnfhlaireal with your rapier and hit for 51 damage!
[03:03:41] You critical hit for an additional 21 damage!
[03:03:41] You attack Donnfhlaireal with your dirk and hit for 45 damage!
[03:03:41] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his rapier!
[03:03:41] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 97 damage.
[03:03:41] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his dirk!
[03:03:41] Donnfhlaireal misses!
[03:03:44] You attack Donnfhlaireal with your rapier and hit for 54 damage!
[03:03:44] Donnfhlaireal evades your attack!
[03:03:44] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his rapier!
[03:03:44] You evade Donnfhlaireal's attack!
[03:03:44] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his dirk!
[03:03:44] You evade Donnfhlaireal's attack!
[03:03:46] You are poisoned!
[03:03:46] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 72 damage.
[03:03:46] You miss!
[03:03:46] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his rapier!
[03:03:46] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 57 damage.
[03:03:46] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his dirk!
[03:03:46] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 62 damage.
[03:03:47] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his rapier!
[03:03:47] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 58 damage.
[03:03:47] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his dirk!
[03:03:47] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 59 damage.
[03:03:48] Donnfhlaireal evades your attack!
[03:03:48] Donnfhlaireal evades your attack!
[03:03:50] You are poisoned!
[03:03:50] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 72 damage.
[03:03:50] Your duel ends!
[03:03:50] Your form is restored.
[03:03:50] Your Constitution has increased.
[03:03:50] Your hits have increased.
[03:03:50] Your form is restored.
[03:03:50] Finvachagen's form is restored.
[03:03:50] You have died. Type /release to return to your last bind point.
[03:03:50] Donnfhlaireal wins the duel!
[03:03:50] You died fighting for your realm and lose no experience!

** NS won with 70% life left **

*** Chat Log Closed: Sat Dec 05 03:03:52 2009


*** Chat Log Opened: Sat Dec 05 03:19:27 2009

** Buffed Ranger vs UnBuffed NS w/ ws/con Debuff + 64 Dot Poison **

[03:19:30] You enter combat mode and target [Donnfhlaireal]
[03:19:32] Donnfhlaireal is too far away to attack!
[03:19:33] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his rapier!
[03:19:33] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 54 damage.
[03:19:33] Your physical essence is weakened!
[03:19:33] Your Constitution has decreased.
[03:19:33] Your hits have decreased.
[03:19:33] Your physical essence is weakened!
[03:19:33] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his dirk!
[03:19:33] Donnfhlaireal misses!
[03:19:33] You attack Donnfhlaireal with your rapier and hit for 75 damage!
[03:19:33] You hit Donnfhlaireal for 20 extra damage!
[03:19:35] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his rapier!
[03:19:35] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 47 damage.
[03:19:35] You attack Donnfhlaireal with your rapier and hit for 68 damage!
[03:19:35] You hit Donnfhlaireal for 14 extra damage!
[03:19:35] Donnfhlaireal evades your attack!
[03:19:37] Donnfhlaireal evades your attack!
[03:19:37] You attack Donnfhlaireal with your dirk and hit for 65 damage!
[03:19:37] You hit Donnfhlaireal for 15 extra damage!
[03:19:37] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his rapier!
[03:19:37] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 64 damage.
[03:19:39] You attack Donnfhlaireal with your rapier and hit for 56 damage!
[03:19:39] You hit Donnfhlaireal for 20 extra damage!
[03:19:39] Donnfhlaireal evades your attack!
[03:19:39] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his rapier!
[03:19:39] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 60 damage.
[03:19:39] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his dirk!
[03:19:39] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 49 damage.
[03:19:39] You are poisoned!
[03:19:39] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 73 damage.
[03:19:40] Donnfhlaireal evades your attack!
[03:19:41] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his dirk!
[03:19:41] Donnfhlaireal misses!
[03:19:42] Donnfhlaireal evades your attack!
[03:19:42] You attack Donnfhlaireal with your dirk and hit for 55 damage!
[03:19:42] You hit Donnfhlaireal for 13 extra damage!
[03:19:43] You are poisoned!
[03:19:43] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 73 damage.
[03:19:43] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his rapier!
[03:19:43] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 64 damage.
[03:19:43] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his dirk!
[03:19:43] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 42 damage.
[03:19:44] You attack Donnfhlaireal with your rapier and hit for 75 damage!
[03:19:44] You hit Donnfhlaireal for 15 extra damage!
[03:19:44] You attack Donnfhlaireal with your dirk and hit for 64 damage!
[03:19:44] You hit Donnfhlaireal for 13 extra damage!
[03:19:45] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his dirk!
[03:19:45] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 51 damage.
[03:19:45] You attack Donnfhlaireal with your rapier and hit for 67 damage!
[03:19:45] You hit Donnfhlaireal for 19 extra damage!
[03:19:45] Donnfhlaireal evades your attack!
[03:19:47] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his rapier!
[03:19:47] You evade Donnfhlaireal's attack!
[03:19:47] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his dirk!
[03:19:47] Donnfhlaireal misses!
[03:19:47] You are poisoned!
[03:19:47] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 72 damage.
[03:19:47] You miss!
[03:19:49] Donnfhlaireal evades your attack!
[03:19:49] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his dirk!
[03:19:49] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 44 damage.
[03:19:50] You attack Donnfhlaireal with your rapier and hit for 63 damage!
[03:19:50] You hit Donnfhlaireal for 15 extra damage!
[03:19:50] You hit Donnfhlaireal for 63 (-22) damage!
[03:19:50] You miss!
[03:19:51] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his dirk!
[03:19:51] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 52 damage.
[03:19:51] You are poisoned!
[03:19:51] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 73 damage.
[03:19:52] You miss!
[03:19:52] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his rapier!
[03:19:52] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 49 damage.
[03:19:54] You attack Donnfhlaireal with your rapier and hit for 56 damage!
[03:19:54] You hit Donnfhlaireal for 18 extra damage!
[03:19:54] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his rapier!
[03:19:54] You evade Donnfhlaireal's attack!
[03:19:54] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his dirk!
[03:19:54] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 54 damage.
[03:19:55] You are poisoned!
[03:19:55] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 72 damage.
[03:19:55] You attack Donnfhlaireal with your rapier and hit for 65 damage!
[03:19:55] You hit Donnfhlaireal for 17 extra damage!
[03:19:55] Donnfhlaireal evades your attack!
[03:19:56] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his dirk!
[03:19:57] You evade Donnfhlaireal's attack!
[03:19:57] Donnfhlaireal evades your attack!
[03:19:57] You attack Donnfhlaireal with your dirk and hit for 60 damage!
[03:19:57] You hit Donnfhlaireal for 13 extra damage!
[03:19:58] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his rapier!
[03:19:58] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 61 damage.
[03:19:58] Donnfhlaireal attacks you with his dirk!
[03:19:58] You evade Donnfhlaireal's attack!
[03:19:59] You are poisoned!
[03:19:59] Donnfhlaireal hits you for 72 damage.
[03:19:59] Your duel ends!
[03:19:59] Your form is restored.
[03:19:59] Your Constitution has increased.
[03:19:59] Your hits have increased.
[03:19:59] Your form is restored.
[03:19:59] Finvachagen's form is restored.
[03:19:59] Your agility returns to normal.
[03:19:59] Your Dexterity has decreased.
[03:19:59] Your Quickness has decreased.
[03:19:59] Your strength returns to normal.
[03:19:59] Your Strength has decreased.
[03:19:59] The shield around you fades.
[03:19:59] You have died. Type /release to return to your last bind point.
[03:19:59] Donnfhlaireal wins the duel!
[03:19:59] You died fighting for your realm and lose no experience!

** NS won with 15% life left **

*** Chat Log Closed: Sat Dec 05 03:20:02 2009