New RvR System (English)
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The frontiers As the playercount increases, we decided to expand the frontiers. All zones that share a border with Agramon are now an active part of the battles. There are several changes and new features, that arrange variety and new challenges. With this RvR system we also introduce relics for the first time. Agramon The keeps and towers in Agramon, that existed until now, have been removed. The outpost towers have been moved back to theur default positions in Hadrian's Wall, Odin's Gate and Emain Macha. The milegates will stay open permanently. Keeps and towers There are totally 3 keeps with 4 towers each, that can be captured. These keeps play a special role, since they are the strongholds to hide and protect the enemy relics. These keeps are Caer Benowyc (Hadrian's Wall), Bledmeer Faste (Odin's Gate) and Dun Crauchon (Emain Macha), also known as the homekeeps. Caer Berkstaed (Hadrian's Wall), Nottmoor Faste (Odin's Gate) and Dun Crimthainn (Emain Macha) are relic keeps. They are secured very well and shelter the realms's own relics. Caer Boldiam (Pennine Mountains), Glenlock Faste (Odin's Gate) and Dun na nGed (Breifine) are static outposts of the realms, also known as teleportkeeps. It is impossible to capture those keeps. In the case a realm loses it's own homekeep and they can't get back there, the teleport to these teleportkeeps is still possible. From there the realm can prepare it's groups and can get back to war. There are all importand npcs and merchants: You can find a healer, siege weapons, crafting merchants, vault keeper, hastener, a smith, rechargers and everything else eligible. Crafting In the keeps Caer Boldiam (Pennine Mountains), Glenlock Faste (Odin's Gate) and Dun na nGed (Breifine) are (as already mentioned) all necessary crafting merchants. Of course the needed tools (forge, lathe, alchemy table) can be found there, too. In these keeps every player always gets a craftspeedbonus of 10%. Here you can find a map of the battlefield. The zones that are not an active part of the war, are darker. _________________________________________________________ Relics There is one relic per realm. Albions relic is "Merlin's Staff", Midgards relic is the "Horn of Valhalla" and Hibernias relic is "Dagda's Cauldron". There relics possess immense powers, of which every player can benefit. If a realm captures an enemy relic, a part of the power will be transfused to the realm. Former information can be found in the bonus system below. The own relic's default position is the realm's relic keep. The relic keep is a very safe fortress. It is protected by high walls and many guards. If the homekeep is owned by the realm that the relic keep belongs to, there will be a lot more guards in the keep. Therefore it is advisable to capture that homekeep before attacking the relic keep. An additional barrier are the two towers (guardtower & watchtower) next to the keep. Noble earls that are experienced in battles serve in these towers. By the power of the relics they are able to summon reincarnations of themselves in the relic keeps. Due these are ghostlike guards, they are vastly more powerful than the earls. As soon as an earl dies, his reincarnation dies, too. Therefore it is also advisable to attack these towers before attacking the relic keep. If the earls are alive, there are bonfires on top of the towers. The last line of defense is the relic keep commander. He is the most experienced commander of the realm. Reams of accolades and commendations honored him. He is a direct delegate of the king and serves the relic's protection. If he dies, the relic can be taken. The relic carrier shoulders a vast burden. He can only move with two thirds of his speed. A cone of light appears upon him, that reaches up to the sky and attracts enemies. The high magicians of the realms are able to localise the area the travelling relic passes, due to their powers, every 10 minutes. The carrier has to bring the relic to his own homekeep. When the relic reaches it, the carrier can put it onto a relicpad and the relic's powers can be extracted and converted to bonuses. If the carrier dies before the relic has reached a relicpad or leaves the world of Uthgard, the relic will be dropped to the ground. Every player can pick it up. The high magicians need 3 hours, to get control of their relic. If the relic has not reached any relicpad within this time, it returns to the relic keep. In that case it is impossible to regain the relic, except an army of brave fighters goes to the relic keep and embraces the relic's destiny... _________________________________________________________ Travelling Teleportation At the telekeeps are portal stones. They can also be found in each keep, that is captureable. They can be used by the realm that owns the keep. It is possible to teleport to these keeps. To teleport into a keep, that you've captured, you will also need to capture all the 4 towers belonging to the keep. If the keep is in enemy territory, your homekeep must also belong to your realm for successfull teleport. From the borderkeeps you can teleport to the realm's encampment in Agramon by talking to an npc. Boats From each docks you can travel to the center of the battlefields (also into enemy lands). For example a player from Albion can take a boat from the docks in Caer Benowyc to Odin's Gate or Emain Macha. The merchants at the docks only sell their tickets to players of their realms. For example it is not possible for a player from Albion to travel from the docks in Bledmeer Faste or Dun Crauchon. Horses In each encampment in Agramon are stable masters, that offer the realm to leave the battle field. There are also stable masters in front of the homekeeps, that offer a ride to Agramon. They can only be used by the realm that it the native owner of the keep. Hasteners In front of each keep a hastener can be found. They grant +50% speed for 10 minutes. They only offer this service for the realm that owns the keep. _________________________________________________________ RvR missions At the telekeeps captains can be found, that are looking for brave mercenaries for dangerous missions. There are singleplayer and group missions. If a mission is completed, you will be rewarded. _________________________________________________________ Bonus system Relics The relics grant their owners powerful bonuses. To obtain the full bonus, your realm has to own it's relic. Per enemy relic, a realm gets the following bonuses:
If the own relic is owned by an enemy realm, you get the following bonuses for each enemy relic:
Keeps If your realm has captured an enemy keep, you get the following bonuses:
After capturing an enemy keep, each player gets an amount of realmpoints. Towers If your realm has captured an enemy tower, you get the following bonuses:
After capturing an enemy tower, each player gets an amount of realmpoints. Static bonuses At any time and for every player the following bonuses are available:
Darkness Falls The access to Darkness Falls is regulated by towers only. There are 12 captureable towers totally. If two or all realms have the same amount of towers, the realm that had access to Darkness Falls will keep the exclusive bonus. You need the majority of all towers, to gain access to Darkness Falls. If the access switches, a timer of 15 minutes starts. If it exceeds, the realm that had the former access will not be able to enter Darkness Falls anymore. Battleground keeps The owners of the battleground keeps will gain the following bonuses:
Last edited by Nayru on Feb 17, 2009 21:30, edited 1 time in total.
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I must say, with this new system you guys did a wonderful job :+)
Been hoping ever sence i started you guys would make a system just like this :+) giveing XP bounce in the RvR zones will keep them Full ^^ argamon/BGs alike :+) And finaly a Relic system.... and how you guys are making the Relic keeps defence is a wonderful idea.... and how strong those relics are, are just perfect with the pop, we have for uthgard. ^^ me personly im most pleased ^^ |
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im freaking excided
  Don't argue with idiots - they'll drag you down to their level and beat you with experience. |
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Currently I have no opinion on the expansion of the rvr zones as I will have to wait and see how this affects the overall traffic of rvr activity, however I do have an opinon on the relic bonuses and a 2nd opinion about what else should be added to the rvr mechanics as a whole. I also have some questions about explaining how some of the new mechanics are going to work. Finally I will leave off with a request for an additional feature to added.
Opinion I: Relic Bonuses I believe adding bonuses for str/dex/acuity is a very bad idea, about on par with the previous decision when agramon system was implemented to make milegates opened via taking milegate towers (which subsequently lead to consistent teleport spawn camping). The reason I believe adding relics that add bonuses to damage to be an ill-conceived idea is that we can only look to live for hindsight on how this affected game play both in terms of 'balance' issues and creating population boons to the side that had the most relics which ultimately leads to virtual one sided fights between the realms. I don't think it will be fun to be hit by players consistantly for xx% more damage than what is already done. I can imagine myself consistently hitting players for 440 and higher damage per attack now should hibernia for instance get all relics. This cannot possibly be a good thing. Even should the towers/keeps be made easier to take by enemy realms if a realm obtains more relics, i firmly believe that it is ultimately going to be the side that has the most players around who ultimately will be controlling and keeping the relics under this system. I think we know that people like to win and the winning sides usually collect the most players. I don't see how, as an example, a force of 20 relic attacking players can fight 50 defenders (who also have the relic bonuses). Personally i like large battles, and having a system in place that encourages focused large battles and cooperative tactics is a good thing in my opinion, however I do not like one-sided battles (no matter who has the advantage) and as such, I cannot be supportive of the current relic bonus system as it exists. I think the relic bonuses as they stand need to be removed and replaced with something far more passive such as potentially massive Gold drop rate and/or item drop rate increases & experience bonuses, and/or slight realm point bonuses. Opinion 2: General RvR Incentives:- http://uthgard-server.net/modules.php?n ... 8&start=45 http://www.uthgard-server.net/modules.p ... c&start=30 In these threads I try to point out some of the larger issues about the rvr zones and how a lot of the frustrations people are feeling abotu them are inter-related. I also offer some proposals for how to handle them to encourage people to be more involved in staying in rvr and doing activities like keep sieging for example. In short people need massive incentives (as compared to what exists now) to participate in certain rvr areas and to do certain realm duties (like taking and defending towers/keeps). Right now there are a lot of social and game mechanic impediments preventing players from doing that effectively or even having desire to do that to begin with. An example of game mechanic impediments that create a lack of incentive for defending a tower/keep is the fact that a defender wont be able to get inside to defend a tower/keep if the enemy is attacking it thanks to the "cannot enter door while in combat" custom feature added to uthgard. Some things I would like explained: 1. How do defenders get into their towers/keep if its under seige if the current "cannot enter keep door while in combat" system is in place? How is it going to be feasible to defend a tower/keep that is under seige if players cannot get inside of it due to being in combat if hitby "ANY" spell or effect/attack prior to reaching thhe door. 2. What incentives are there to keep people playing at all if the other realm has all the relics and these people are always fighting against for example, 3:1 odds in terms of population of the enemy realm (who also now has damage bonuses)? 3. This ties into question 2, where I would also like to know what steps are being taken to disencourage realmchanging/and or crossrealming with this new system in place. My fear is that if a realm gets relics, then a lot of players will be changing realms and with the current ease of changing characters/accounts, you can potentially see mass exodus of players from one realm to another or back and forth realm hopping. I think there should be some strict measures taken to encourage people to stay on their own realm. Here is the original dicussion on this matter and also my opinion about what should/could be done about it: http://uthgard-server.net/modules.php?n ... st&p=84830 Feature that I would like to see added Realm Points for Structure Repairs Since this relic system is a custom feature, I don't see the harm in proposing a custom addition. Something I would like to see done is to add Realm Points for door repairs. This would further encourage players to perform realm duties such as door / keep repair and reward those who take the time and effort of carrying around supplies and doing tradeskills in order to fully repair these structures. As a live prescedent, mythic has done this with the 1.81 patch:
I would recommend making the tower/keep repairs rates to be affected by player woodworking skills. The speed of the repair would be affected by the player's skill level with each structure type requiring a certain level of skill to repair. As an example, gates and walls would require 200 minimum woodworking skill to repair, however at this level it would take 60 seconds for each 5% repair. At 1000 skill then repairs would take the normal 20 seconds. The speed of repair would of course then vary between 200-1000 skill, giving virtually all craft skill levels some meaningful contribution to the realm defense. As for realm points gained, i believe this should given a fixed value per object section. As an example, all objects could be worth 1000 realm points to repair if they are repaired from 0% condition. If an object is at 50% condition then the player would only get 500 rps max if they repaired it to 100%. Each repair would then give the player 25 realm points. In the case of repairing an object from 0% condition, each repair would give 50. Last edited by Zippity on Feb 16, 2009 06:32, edited 7 times in total.
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I got wood and Its not the type to repair doors with.
Good job staff.  |
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Sounds realy realy nice. Now rvr will be complete.I want see what will say all players who dont like zerg
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This is the way mythic intented to be. This is becoming more live-like, the best thing. The relic bonuses are half that they are supposed to be, because THESE should be the real bonuses. So 5% its perfect, and the tower implemented bonus its perfect.
@ zip , you speak about "a force of 20 relic attacking players can fight 50 defenders" , this never happened and never will, the ratio its not that big, maybe 20 vs 30. Its the perfect balance, because 1 realm even if he has all relics will not be able to defend itself from other 2 realms that want their relics back. Relic raids on live servers are well planed and scheduled, but on uthgard this is impossible. So next step should be making x-realming IMPOSSIBLE so that "'balance issues and creating population boons to the side that had the most relics" should be inexistant. And personally, i missed climbing walls and treboucheting keeps, emain was so fun, and this cant fail. Cheers. |
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If this server were livelike, animists as of 1.80 would also have the ability to cast 100 mushrooms in a 1500 unit radius, stealthers would be able to be attacked by pets while stealthed...players could enter towers/keeps while under attack. I could go on to list other custom features that have been added here. I just dont buy into the whole 'lets pick and choose' logic behind this. My opinion is that you either go with one system all the way or dont do it. If you are copying mythic, then copy mythic, if you want to customise it, then customise it, just dont masquerade it as 'live-like' if its really not. The current system as proposed is for the most part a custom change which has resemblance to live server features. That's fine..
The only thing I am talking about here with my previous post is that if a relic system is giogn to be put in place then there are other vantage points that need to be explored here and potential issues should be addressed and accounted for.
As for this, i respectfully disagree. When you observe the ebb and flow of fights and rvr traffic as I have done over the past months, you will see that certain realms are more prone to having this situation happen than others are. Relic bonuses will (I fear) only exacerbate this problem. As I mentioned before, I like large fights, however i strongly dislike one-sided fights. If the previous 'custom' changes have been done so on uth to improve game play and 'balance' for hte majority of players..then i would surely HOPE that the issue of relics ought to be treated the same way since hindsight from live should show clearly what happens when realms have "ANY" advantage in the form of bonuses (especially relics). |
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Don't judge the things before seeing how they work. Mythic fixed that stealth issue post 1.80 because they figured it out that late. Its not about these issues, its about RvR layout. What are you speaking are minor issues and it doesnt put uthgard so far away from live. Uth staff made sure that skills/ra's/whatever works properly , reworked poisons, phisical defense and whatever ra's, drops, skills, to make players happy that they work like its supposed to work. This is the next step, because RvR layout its supposed to work like this , and this is the best change since i play uthgard.
Of course there are issues like xrealming for bonuses or whatever, and we need to discuss them, but thinking that bonuses are bad it's wrong. |
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When will be implemented new system?
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I do not think encouraging populations to grow on any realm to reach 2:1, 3:1, 5:1 (or whatever) odds in comparison to other realms is a minor issue. I'm not even disagreeing with having 'relics' at all as a means to facilitate cooperative behavior between people in the same realm. I just think that if this is going to be a custom system then bonuses should be changed to reflect hindsight issues that live had with this exact same issue. The issue still being, the realm that has the most bonuses is naturally most likely going to be the realm that gets the most population aand with more population you have more one sided fights, PLUS added damage bonuses that help make sure that realm keeps this population and one-sided fight nature. What i am warning against here is a self replicating cycle that was seen on live and can very likely happen on uth as well. |
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I'm really enthousiastic about these changes. Not only the zone expansion but certainly the relics. This will add some more flavour to rvr whereas atm the only thing that it's good for is rp-farming and df control.
I'm curious on how it will all work out but I'm quite optimistic. @Zippity: Yes one realm will have an advantage over the other(s) but I can only see this as a motivation for realm x to regain their relic. And +5% strength really isn't going to matter in a relic raid. The system might not be perfect yet but I'm sure the staff will monitor when it goes live and adjust it if necessary. |
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I think some of us see already what happened with the 'motivation' with retaking towers to close your own milegate. Essentially when that milegate tower got taken, rvr turned into camp fests. I dont' see much difference in the types of frustration that caused and what would be caused by losing all of your relics and having another side always have xx% damage bonus against you no matter where you are. I believe this is simply trading one bad system with another. I believe that since uth is using a custom relic system, that hindsight should be used and that there should not be bonuses that directly affect combat mechanics. |
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Wow,i think it will bring so much fun and movement in agra, just maybe a tower to open milegates was ok too and ppl can zerg-creep by the irish see swimming if they wanna ninja ehe just an idea btw really great job , cheer to the 2 new Gm and thank to everyone,Uth is just the best server
Rakjsh |
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Zippity I think u're just twisting things.
Realms will never be perfectly balanced, there will always be a stronger realm at a certain point, and yes it will probably have more relics. But putting relics as the cause of this, just isn't right. Midzerg as we all know it has been hard to counter by any other realm, making mid the 'strongest' realm of the past few weeks, however there's no relics in play. I really don't think relics would be to blame for any unbalances. Unbalances will just be more visible. I for one would always be happy to join the underdog tbh. I haven't read all your comments but I'm just going to try out what seems to me a great and fun system, should I feel something's wrong I won't hesitate to give feedback, but for now I'm just hoping for it be as good as I think it will be .
Grts, Zrawk/Ifrig |
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