Airo wrote:So are Savages useful in 8mans in this patch or are they at a bad point in 1.65?

Of course they are useful, we will run either 2 Zerks+ Savage or maybe even try a Zerk+Savage+Warrior on our train, and in the 2 Zerk setup the Savage can freelance as well.

Not only can the Savage participate in the tank train, by freelancing properly (ofc no overextend) he can find an out of position caster and drop him quickly by himself, so you can task your groups Savage with train duty, or hunting/freelance duty.

Like someone else posted earlier, in dedicated guild 8 mans you will find Savages a mainstay imo, in PuG groups not so much probably.

Jalez wrote:

Airo wrote:So are Savages useful in 8mans in this patch or are they at a bad point in 1.65?

Of course they are useful, we will run either 2 Zerks+ Savage or maybe even try a Zerk+Savage+Warrior on our train, and in the 2 Zerk setup the Savage can freelance as well.

Not only can the Savage participate in the tank train, by freelancing properly (ofc no overextend) he can find an out of position caster and drop him quickly by himself, so you can task your groups Savage with train duty, or hunting/freelance duty.

Like someone else posted earlier, in dedicated guild 8 mans you will find Savages a mainstay imo, in PuG groups not so much probably.

Thanks for the info. Im going to be rolling one, ive looked up info about which race to pick and everywhere is saying Troll/Kobold is best but im not sure if that applies to this 1.65 patch we are on. Id rather make mine a Norseman, will i be at a disadvantage if i do and if so how much of a disadvantage? Ive posted in the "Savage" forum section but not had a reply yet could you provide any info on this? Thanks.

Airo wrote:Thanks for the info. Im going to be rolling one, ive looked up info about which race to pick and everywhere is saying Troll/Kobold is best but im not sure if that applies to this 1.65 patch we are on. Id rather make mine a Norseman, will i be at a disadvantage if i do and if so how much of a disadvantage? Ive posted in the "Savage" forum section but not had a reply yet could you provide any info on this? Thanks.

The reason why Trolls are so good is because of their base quickness being so low. With high savagery (the self buffs) you get a 39% base haste buff, and that stacks with celerity. Since quickness only effects weapon swing and (1/2) of your evade chance, you don't generally need it for the class. In truth, most savage templates don't cap out Quickness because you're going to be grouped up so often. Troll/norse are the best race imo, Norse more so for soloing and Troll if you wanna hit hard with the zerkers.

yeah savage is very bad class go zerk everyone pls

"Why I Don't Group With Savages "


im going to answer this ... while asking a question...

do you know why savages are Blacklisted from bomber groups?
why they get the sm's killed?

here's a clue... 99% of all melee class players dont know wtf, or how the ******, to use a stun.

savage in group means all stunned mobs HE is on... isnt stunned anymore. he broke it, and got the sm killed... healers now working overtime because of the broken CC.

dont believe me? try getting a savage in a bomber group.
at this point the SM (if only 1) is already typing /release... before combat started.
the pac healer is too busy healing to do anymore CC... so the savage made the healer stop CC'ing and start healing...

Remember this for rvr^^

Stun not working???? WELL GEE figure out how CC works
google it. not going to bother explaining it to a buncha (wannabe) "elitist." you can go google it and educate yourselves.
maybe they'll learn to melee better as a result.

Timing... is everything.

(yes 100% of all savage players (to include 99% slam-bot-wanna-be's) i have seen... dont know how to use stun properly, and just spam it like a 17yr old who just figured out how his junk worked)

that said... a savage is the LAST !!!! VERY LAST!!! class i will ever consider for a group. period. i dont want cookie cutter newbie savages in group. and it is 100% of all i have seen on midgard. infact i am surprised Albion hasn't awarded yall with a Player of the month award for how much STUN REMOVAL you do. if you see me on my pac healer, just know its either me ... or you, but one of us is leaving group... and i don't have trouble finding groups the /disband function is on my side, not yours. LOL !

take it or leave it, dont care
but if you View this as a warning - you might be more successful in: rvr, duels, pve... Everywhere CC is.

Dear Melee:
LRn2Play

learn to stun properly, and youll be fine. learn the timing of OTHER PLAYERS STUNS AS WELL!!!

drakuz wrote:"Why I Don't Group With Savages "


im going to answer this ... while asking a question...

do you know why savages are Blacklisted from bomber groups?
why they get the sm's killed?

here's a clue... 99% of all melee class players dont know wtf, or how the ******, to use a stun.

savage in group means all stunned mobs HE is on... isnt stunned anymore. he broke it, and got the sm killed... healers now working overtime because of the broken CC.

dont believe me? try getting a savage in a bomber group.
at this point the SM (if only 1) is already typing /release... before combat started.
the pac healer is too busy healing to do anymore CC... so the savage made the healer stop CC'ing and start healing...

Remember this for rvr^^

Stun not working???? WELL GEE figure out how CC works
google it. not going to bother explaining it to a buncha (wannabe) "elitist." you can go google it and educate yourselves.
maybe they'll learn to melee better as a result.

Timing... is everything.

(yes 100% of all savage players (to include 99% slam-bot-wanna-be's) i have seen... dont know how to use stun properly, and just spam it like a 17yr old who just figured out how his junk worked)

that said... a savage is the LAST !!!! VERY LAST!!! class i will ever consider for a group. period. i dont want cookie cutter newbie savages in group. and it is 100% of all i have seen on midgard. infact i am surprised Albion hasn't awarded yall with a Player of the month award for how much STUN REMOVAL you do. if you see me on my pac healer, just know its either me ... or you, but one of us is leaving group... and i don't have trouble finding groups the /disband function is on my side, not yours. LOL !

take it or leave it, dont care
but if you View this as a warning - you might be more successful in: rvr, duels, pve... Everywhere CC is.

Dear Melee:
LRn2Play

cool.
On a more serious not: Instead of writing that horrible wall of text that basically sums up to telling people to "****** off and google that ******" you could have used that time to actually help and explain why you don't like chain stunning savages. Would have probably been shorter, too. Like two sentences or something...

Oh, and didn't I see similar posts in Alb forums before? Have we rerolled to Mid, lately?

Llaw wrote:The only reason why 2H Savage was a thing way back then, was because the class was fundamentally broken. The tri- and quad-hits were assigned to the class itself, and not styles, which meant that you could get tri and quad-hits using any type of weapon, even two-handed.

Now thats just wrong, the reason was a much higher weaponskill with 2handed weapons (like +300 or something) that got nerfed and the possibility to use very slow weapons (restricted to 5.5 after nerf).

About savages vs zerks, ppl already told about the lack of snare and 1hand mechanics on savage but there are also advantages like the type of damage they deal. A good savage will swap between slash and thrust claws depending on the target while your zerks mostly have to stick to crush damage. If you ever hit an alb cleric with crush weapons, you know how crapy your damage can be.

So i think to pick one good savage will be a good choice.

If you run a group with 3 healers and celerity is up more often than not then Zerk > Svg. If only running 2 healer and/or celerity is not often cast then i'd prefer the savage and their self haste. Also as has been mentioned if there is one tank following the svg around guarding you'll see how much the lack of dual wield hurts the class.

Early on so far there have been more Alb/Hib caster groups than there have been tank set-ups, that favors Savages. Melee groups generally come later since they're tougher to lvl and gear up, so we'll see if Zerks become more desired as Savages get guarded out.

isocleas2 wrote:Also as has been mentioned if there is one tank following the svg around guarding you'll see how much the lack of dual wield hurts the class.

Im confused. Im 100% certain my savage is dual wielding. I have a weapon in each hand = dual wielding.

mgp4ever wrote:

isocleas2 wrote:Also as has been mentioned if there is one tank following the svg around guarding you'll see how much the lack of dual wield hurts the class.

Im confused. Im 100% certain my savage is dual wielding. I have a weapon in each hand = dual wielding.

but dont count in the code as dual wield. 1 shield and youre fkup

woopdiwoop wrote:

mgp4ever wrote:

isocleas2 wrote:Also as has been mentioned if there is one tank following the svg around guarding you'll see how much the lack of dual wield hurts the class.

Im confused. Im 100% certain my savage is dual wielding. I have a weapon in each hand = dual wielding.

but dont count in the code as dual wield. 1 shield and youre fkup

Thata just the most retarded thing I have ever heard. Sounds like a bug that needs to be fixed.

mgp4ever wrote:
Thata just the most retarded thing I have ever heard. Sounds like a bug that needs to be fixed.

While I agree, the staff doesn't. ONLY bugs that didn't exist in 1.65 will be considered for fixing. This existed back then and therefore will remain an unfortunate characteristic of Savages which more or less gimps them.

It's not like you'll be fighting shield wielders from the front that often. Yeah it kind of sucks, but if there's anything that makes Savage bad, it isn't that.
Edit: I completely forgot about Guard, but really, that won't be a problem until we see some highly ranked groups, Guard is ineffective at low RR (and with the current Paladin / Hib tank population...)

H2H considered as single, not dual weilded weapon is not bug.