Would you consider playing a paladin in 8v8 RVR with the knowledge that they WILL lose determination upon old RA implementation? Will groups replace them with Armsmen/Mercenaries b/c these two classes will be able to have 75% CC reduction and Paladins will have none? I know Endo chant is important but if paladins are rooted / mezzed the entire fight then what good is the chant? I'm guessing that armsmen will take their place with playing defense. Please discuss.

Learn to play around this.

Have group members with a tank attacking them run toward the Paladin to intercept a blow in order to break the Root.

Don't kite/push to hard if the Paladin is rooted. Mesmerize shouldn't be an issue at all for well-played Sorcerers. Have Friar's join the group to provide Heat/Cold/Matter resists to help lower the durations of root spells.

Rather put in a armsmen than a paladin. With old ra's Paladin's become useless in groups. Grab some endu pots from housing group a armsmen and then move out

_Oglop_ wrote:Learn to play around this.

Have group members with a tank attacking them run toward the Paladin to intercept a blow in order to break the Root.

Don't kite/push to hard if the Paladin is rooted. Mesmerize shouldn't be an issue at all for well-played Sorcerers. Have Friar's join the group to provide Heat/Cold/Matter resists to help lower the durations of root spells.

Dunno why you want to make things complicated. Even with the current RA system, it is possible to take the paladin completly out of the fight. Fortunately there is rarely anyone who really thinks about that

Imo the best thing is if you try to replace the paladin with an armsman. You'll benefit from defensive ra's and in theory it should be easier to control the enemy offtanks. The only reason why paladins get grouped at all, is the endurance chant. 1000 Range isn't much and this is the reason, why most tanks are forced to use endu regeneration pots during the fight. This can be because he got out of range due to cc, he simply has to defend his supporters which are also out of the range to the tanks, or setups force you to split the group.
So better group a more useful class in the backline, use some endurance pots and don't make fights dependent on the 'playstyle' of the enemy cc'ers

Old RA means Tireless RA. I guess that Tireless + endu regen pots will be enough to say good bye to pally.
If you talk about team of course. I think that pug will still group pally since they often run without this kind of pots.

yeah I agree, 75% cc reduction > 1000 range endo chant any day. Soldier's barricade < Pally rr5, but not by much. Armsman it is. Just wish polearm and two hand styles weren't so gimped here

Oh and no dashing defense is going to stink... won't be rolling a saracen armsman that's for sure!

But enjoy solo on paladins. They were pretty pimp solo melee back with OF RA.

I havent played for along time (just got to 50 again), but paladins were always considered core to a 8v8 before new RA's. Even without det, demezz and purge should keep them being useful, Infact I guess its even more reason to run with a minstrel (sos and demezz).

When I played 8v8 on my paladin on excal, the group setup was always 2 clerics, sorc, air theurg, ministrel, paladin, 2 arms/merc.

won't paladins get faith heal? 100% group insta heal if i remember correctly? that would be awesome in a full group.

Wow.. this thread keeps getting more and more interesting. GROUP FULL INSTA!? Sign me up!

So you would group a paladin because he got 1 insta full heal each 30 minutes? gl hf then

lul!

No dmg, no det, no need for enduchant, but an instaheal!
Nice! I´ll respec my cleric to Smite/Heal. Got Instaheal then and some decent dmg! Even better than a pally.

Hibernianman1 wrote:Wow.. this thread keeps getting more and more interesting. GROUP FULL INSTA!? Sign me up!

If memory serves it was more like 75%. Still a nice RA, but I don't think it is enough to replace DET on paper. It could work with a pala, but in paperdaoc defensive armsman wins.

you also miss out the resistance chants...in old RA times caster grps were much betterthan in our current setup, which means there might be more caster grps again...so a good paly will twist proper resist chants along with endu...especially without friars in normal alb setups this will make a difference...not a major argument but it's not like palies don't have anything to offer at all....

ofc the pro-gamer-grps will all have tons of endu pots and won't need endu, but the more casual grps (not only pugs, but also grps not running the same setup every night) will not use endu pots so excessively, so endu from pala will be vital...