Blackbeard_ wrote:On High RR Ranger can spec a lot good ras.....yes no mos but u will see Ranger will Pop every 10 min for like 1 min and can kill everyting on a good range with sniperspec ^^

True Sight is 1 min every 30 minutes.

Hibernianman1 wrote:

BalianIbelin wrote:When they take out the last 14 levels of BG accessibility, it will be time to stop playing Uthgard for a lot of people. Just too painful to try to fight RR11's if you have to start out doing it at RR2 or RR3. It's hard enough for new players as it is, this will kill it for them.

I have really enjoyed Uthgard, I'm sorry to see it going down the toilet like this. =(

aww, sorry but you gotta be tough sometimes and fight your way to the top.

Yeah that's true, but it's a game and should be fun. The Battlegrounds were the only thing making the PVE grind tolerable. This will suck the remaining fun out of the level grind and make it not worth it for newer players. All you high RR guys will have your wishes, but you may find it deters newer players. Good luck once this all goes live.

I ask again, who cares about stealthers?
Join a grp and learn to play seriously.

BalianIbelin wrote:

Hibernianman1 wrote:

BalianIbelin wrote:When they take out the last 14 levels of BG accessibility, it will be time to stop playing Uthgard for a lot of people. Just too painful to try to fight RR11's if you have to start out doing it at RR2 or RR3. It's hard enough for new players as it is, this will kill it for them.

I have really enjoyed Uthgard, I'm sorry to see it going down the toilet like this. =(

aww, sorry but you gotta be tough sometimes and fight your way to the top.

Yeah that's true, but it's a game and should be fun. The Battlegrounds were the only thing making the PVE grind tolerable. This will suck the remaining fun out of the level grind and make it not worth it for newer players. All you high RR guys will have your wishes, but you may find it deters newer players. Good luck once this all goes live.

If you can't compete than drop the "fair 8v8" mentality and simply steam roll them in numbers. Also try roaming zones other than Emain and you may run into groups seeking fights similar to your skill level. It was, and still is normal, on live to start out at rr1, rr2, or rr3 . . . and they have a hell of a lot more rr 10 - rr13 players.

Realm Points are not going to be handed to you, you're going to get battle scars on your climb toward the top.

Celteen wrote:I ask again, who cares about stealthers?
Join a grp and learn to play seriously.

I say again, stealth has been a part of DAOC since the start.

A better question would be who cares about Celteen or his opinions?

_Oglop_ wrote:If you can't compete than drop the "fair 8v8" mentality and simply steam roll them in numbers.

Then get looked down at as "those zerging noobs" by your realm mates and be passed over for 8 man groups because of it when you are high enough realm rank.

svperstar wrote:

_Oglop_ wrote:If you can't compete than drop the "fair 8v8" mentality and simply steam roll them in numbers.

Then get looked down at as "those zerging noobs" by your realm mates and be passed over for 8 man groups because of it when you are high enough realm rank.

You gotta start somewhere to get your RvR experience.

aww, sorry but you gotta be tough sometimes and fight your way to the top.

If you can't compete than drop the "fair 8v8" mentality and simply steam roll them in numbers. Also try roaming zones other than Emain and you may run into groups seeking fights similar to your skill level. It was, and still is normal, on live to start out at rr1, rr2, or rr3 . . . and they have a hell of a lot more rr 10 - rr13 players.

Realm Points are not going to be handed to you, you're going to get battle scars on your climb toward the top.

You gotta start somewhere to get your RvR experience.

I love the insight rr10 players are sharing so generously.
However the harsh reality is that removing the last BG deeply hurts new players and ultimately, server population. I'm pretty sure it's very fun to auto-win fights due to massive RR advantage, but try to keep in perspective that population is not abundant. Consistently roflstomping new players, with player skill not even being a part of the equation, will only simply drive them away. Leveling to 50 is already a big entry barrier, so adding another and even harsher one doesn't really make sense.
It's understandable that in such a small community elitism is a common trait, but in there's a line that needs to be drawn somewhere for the greater good of the server.

orfeoulis wrote:

I love the insight rr10 players are sharing so generously.
However the harsh reality is that removing the last BG deeply hurts new players and ultimately, server population. I'm pretty sure it's very fun to auto-win fights due to massive RR advantage, but try to keep in perspective that population is not abundant. Consistently roflstomping new players, with player skill not even being a part of the equation, will only simply drive them away. Leveling to 50 is already a big entry barrier, so adding another and even harsher one doesn't really make sense.
It's understandable that in such a small community elitism is a common trait, but in there's a line that needs to be drawn somewhere for the greater good of the server.

I agree, removing current BGs would only cause more harm then good.
Lets be honest, PvE here is a complete bore and its hard to imagine anyone wanting to play a 10 year old game for its PvE grind, especially when there are much better options available (say WoW free servers or any free to play mmorpg would have better PvE then this game).
Yet on a regular day you will see ~200 people (US time zone) online and at most maybe one or two groups of players in Emain RvRing, sometimes none. Most of them are likely rerolling new toons for BGs or perhaps they actually like torturing themselves with endless grinds and never do any RvR, BG or frontiers.

If you take out the current BGs and replace them with the old ones which ends at lvl 35 (http://tekener.com/cgi-bin/maps?realm=frontiers&lang=en)
Then BG rerollers may be frustrated they cannot RvR at Wilton (lvl 36 - 43) & Thid (lvl 44-49) and rage quit. The rest will just reroll through the 4 BGs (lvl 15 through 35) and then restart. New players who wanted to make it to 50 and do frontiers RvR will have a tougher time making it there (BG makes leveling a lot easier since it provides XP and RPs while you are actually having fun), and a majority of them will give up from the boring PvE grind from 35 to 49. Then you have long time players who occasionally want to start on a new realm or make an alt and will find that getting an XP group past lvl 35 will be even harder since you will no longer have that XPing population of rerollers.

But the most devastating thing is that new players or even your new alts will not be able to get 4L2 from Thidranki for when you character hits 50.

This is what the "classic" BGs provide:
- Caledonia - levels 30 - 35, Realm rank 1, Realm level up to 9 (1L9)
- Murdaigean - levels 25 - 29, Realm rank 1, Realm level up to 5 (1L5)
- Thidranki - levels 20 - 24, Realm rank 1, Realm level up to 3 (1L3)
(see http://camelotherald.wikia.com/wiki/Patch_Notes:_Version_1.48)
And another website listing similar RR max (the RR you get kicked out at), but including Abermenai (http://www.gatecentral.com/daoc/doc/battleground_l12.php)

So the maximum your new character or alt will have when he is finished with the BGs is 2L0, versus the current 4L2 (which does a nice job of providing new 50s with basic RAs). Hopefully, your character will be something like 2L2 from sporadic action from DF or frontiers XP groups, but good luck getting an Emain group with that RR.
I suppose you could take your 2L0 lvl 49 to keep taking and tasking until it hits something around 4Lx and is able to get some essential RAs to RvR.

_Oglop_ wrote:It was, and still is normal, on live to start out at rr1, rr2, or rr3 . . . and they have a hell of a lot more rr 10 - rr13 players.

You're wrong.
If you talk about a time where there is "a lot" of RR10-13, then you talk about a time where you can reach higher RR before entering end game RvR, and a time where you can gain (a lot of) rps easily without fighting any high RR : keep with more los, gloabl RP for defending, RP for heal, RP while dead, RP while reapairing door (lol), ...

I don't say that i would like to see this easy RP on Uthgard, but Uthgard target version is a hard set-up for new players, and it is harder for them due to the "old" players who reached high RR. That's true and... that's not live like

And this is unfair since this same players get their xp and rp in a time where it was a lot more easy : level 20 in few hours thanks to bug, hastener at spawn point, very low damage from mob untill lvl 40, camp fire (they will be removed i guess, since it's a 1.8x feature), tajendi (easy xp + easy ubah loot), RP while dead, no decreased amount of RP from guard mission, etc.

But i understand that you want to encourage this 2L unstuff to build a zerg of 3 fg to fight high RR team. We all know what would be the result.

orfeoulis wrote:try to keep in perspective that population is not abundant. Consistently roflstomping new players, with player skill not even being a part of the equation, will only simply drive them away. Leveling to 50 is already a big entry barrier, so adding another and even harsher one doesn't really make sense.

And i would like to add that without new players, population would certainly be very very low. I don't have any global statistics on the amount of new accounts of course, but what i see is that there less players than before while 30% of our guild are new players of Uthgard.
Uthgard seems to rely on new players to maintain a decent amount of players.

undefined wrote:The rest will just reroll through the 4 BGs (lvl 15 through 35) and then restart.

I was already planning on leveling a scout to 15 for the old BGs if they ever come out. I have no plan of playing Scout in emain with old ras but at level 15-35 before people have See Hidden it is still a lot of fun.

RR10 players were the absolute minority even during SI cause people who started playing DAoC in 2001 were not 10 year veterans...

removing the BGs is a big mistake... cause you not only have a huge population of RR10+ players but a huge population of RR10+ players sitting on templates that are just simply better than newbie ones cause the better than classic items in it are now no longer available

Look, if you guys want those of us who are new to uthgard to leave so you can keep stroking your neckbeards in peace, just say so

eLdritchD wrote: ...RR10+ players sitting on templates that are just simply better than newbie ones cause the better than classic items in it are now no longer available

...

you simply have no clue, or?

all cap (grp)template, except for hybrid and stealther (rofl), ca. 10p and no tajendi/dragon/megalodon etc. item.

edith: btw, the only tajendi item i own is the cloak.

HulkGris wrote:

_Oglop_ wrote:It was, and still is normal, on live to start out at rr1, rr2, or rr3 . . . and they have a hell of a lot more rr 10 - rr13 players.

You're wrong.
If you talk about a time where there is "a lot" of RR10-13, then you talk about a time where you can reach higher RR before entering end game RvR, and a time where you can gain (a lot of) rps easily without fighting any high RR : keep with more los, gloabl RP for defending, RP for heal, RP while dead, RP while reapairing door (lol), ...

Go play a 14 day trial on live. Its free. Level up to 50 (it takes about 2-3 hours) and get your epic gear and run out to the frontiers.

RPs arent sourced from where you're saying, other than maybe "keep los" as there are keep fights. No one makes substantial gains from rp/heal, rp/repairing, rp/defense bonuses (and frankly, if you die most people kite out of range for you getting RP anyway).

Also notice the number of RR1-4 running around mixed in with the 9-13

Sinoda wrote:

eLdritchD wrote: ...RR10+ players sitting on templates that are just simply better than newbie ones cause the better than classic items in it are now no longer available

...

you simply have no clue, or?

all cap (grp)template, except for hybrid and stealther (rofl), ca. 10p and no tajendi/dragon/megalodon etc. item.

edith: btw, the only tajendi item i own is the cloak.

They are just looking for excuses.
My first temp cost me 7p, standard jewelery and lasted till rr10.
So what?