I would like to touch on the topic of current RvR population/action (not total population).

In relation to current playstyles and efforts, RvR zones have primarily turned into Keep-take simulators. While I understand not all inc is fair inc there should be a proper way to address these issues within the current state. While many old timers here don't like change a simple solution would be to remove the 3 minute timer delay from the Herald. Currently you can roam all day with no inc. On the chance a keep take group wants to go out you'll be left in the wake of Romu/Ripbro tactics of take one keep in said zone then die and port to a new zone to take another keep. This is by no means effective for the current state of RVR (Keep vs Keep). Not to touch on grps vs grps but even the simple functions of defending a keep become useless with these keep takers tactics. By the time a keep is on fire and you react solo (just you, because god forbid you ask ppl to come and they take 10 minutes to finish their coffee) it is far too late to defend it. So maybe go to the next keep and defend? Too bad, they switched zones and you'll never catch them. While this might be effective for keep take groups I do not think it promotes the fundamentals of RvR. As mentioned by many in the first place and delay on herald timer kills response times and effective counters for defense.
Focusing on Keep only rps might be a means for certain players to have fun but it also destroys the core concept of defending or making a response before its too late. This would focus on inc rather than pve for rps content and hopefully give people who cant rvr a chance to learn their classes in the field since bgs are apparently empty.

Naturally the task system to be implemented can further encourage ppl to get out and do their part without a full group behind them and encourage smaller grp play rather than zergs. I by all means have 0 issues playing lesser numbers to be on even footing for a proper and decent inc. The inc that rewards you with adrenaline down-to-the-line suspense for a glorious victory. I fully embraced fighting a 4v1 keep take grp in the open to find the thrill of battle. Got the sorc to 0% but didnt diee!!!!!!!!!!! what a rush that was! I couldn't even be disappointed!

Without a doubt changes need to be made to ensure endgame content isnt the end of the game. Yes we all manage but a simple solution would be to take away the delay from the herald.

Another would be the imitation of live where crossed swords on the realm war map represent action in the field not at keeps. This visibly shows action in the game and can spur ppl to come out and look for that.

On that note I also think bringing back vote polls are a great way to gain insight from the population while also closing them to results so you're not obligated to make the changes just because ppl complain.

I know you guys are working on stuff as you can and those here that stick around do appreciate it! Hope the insight helps~

I am also sad to see the action only turn around the keep, that despite being full grp, level 50, they never try to fight in plain and / or roam.
For me they are not real PvP team, and I make a difference between PvP and keeptake which is a more PvE action (open DF/xp bonus arround...)

Remove the 3 minute timmer on the Herald map? You will not win anything!
If people switch realm, it is precisely to avoid defensors and INC.
Remove the timer and you will no longer perssons who will take the Keep!

After, I understand very well your disarray, the action is bland, there are only few active team, and the maps are too big to let 12 players run over to to play hide and seek.

Today build a smallman or a full group pure PvP, it returns to roam 3 hours to kill only 2 xper astray ...

Yet I remain convinced, that some players would like find the thrill of INC, maybe not in FG (not always possible) but with smallman, solo.

I know that for many of you, you do not like battleground (thid / caledonia), but a battleground level 50 would be a possible solution (provisional), the people who will be there for PvP and not PvE / keeptake, the map would be reduced (no need to run 3 hours for nothing) ...

Maybe more bright ideas are to be hoped, but removing the timer for INC every time on players who do not want PvP, we will lose them and encourage them to stop Uthgard.

RvR is not safe, it is not given, it is a hostile environment, and a place where your risk is worth reward. If a player feels they needs to hide behind a timer so they can avoid inc then they shouldn't be doing it in the first place. Stay in a non rvr zone and there are no need for RPS. No they want and use their RA's against me just fine. If any of these players have issue or dispute they can raise their voices. They shouldn't need you to white knight for them. Which I also find ironic that you defend such players while also joining our gank groups to kill them. Not very white knight.

The current system allows for a group or keep zerg to roam FZ with no answer by jumping from realm to realm avoiding inc. This is not how the game should be played and should they want to play like this they can, but they must do it faster than someone who wants to defend has the chance.

I do not feel like defending them by saying <For me it's not really a PvP team>
There are dozens of ways to play DAOC, farmer, Raid Boss, PvP players in the Battleground, those who are only for pure PvP, other than for the keeptake.

In no case you have the right to judge that this way of playing is good or bad, not even to be insulting towards those who would not have the same vision as you (cf the chat alliance). Moreover, I received many send (some of your friends) who said to me <let, it is a kid>.

You would like to play like Call of Duty, INC everytime, without ever having PvE, without lost any time, but you do not make any analysis about the current state of the server (you come back after leave 1 month on rival server) and you do not want to accept the gameplay of your enemy. On this server at the current time, with the players we have, it's impossible, we have to accept it

Here, try to explain me , why they takes a keep on mid, then switch on hib to take another?
Just to avoid INC => you.
Why? Because you're here at each keep ... Finally you complain about a gameplay you're the main responssable and I'm lauthing at reading you. I feel like I'm going back to primary school <If you do not agree with me, I'll break your head at recreation>
Should we get here? To meet you IRL to know who is the most incorrodible? How it's childish!

I do not defend perssonne, or no more alb than you, yes by what I defend you when I say <I understand very well your disarray>. Just like the mayor of the village, I try to see the vision of everyone, the game is not exclusive to "ProGamer", it is there for all types of players, but you could understand it if you had been you even GameMaster on a server, and not just a selfish player who stomp every time a villain is not your opinion.

I invite you to reread the homepage of the server
<Whether your aim is to dominate enemies in the frontier, become a legendary crafter, or defeat dragons throughout the land, Uthgard has a place for you!>

I remain however mostly agree with you, the RvR is sad and it would be very desirable that we can have real fight, but it is not your idea that will solve anything here. If you were not so disagreeable, we could surely agree, since basically I agree with you, there is a problem of gameplay.
I am not the cause of your Probs (IRL/In Game)!!!

Maybe the players could make an effort, but even if it's not the case, it's up to everyone to adapt their game with the current configuration, and not the game to adapt to you!
This is what we have been doing SINCE 3 months, while you were going to play on one another server ... (this is not a reproach, you are free to do what you like).

It says, we can all have different points of view, but respect each other. Respect me my friend, or there will be no next time!

I'm pretty sure it's you who doesn't understand the current state. My point is pretty clear.

How, according to a response where I am 80% in agreement with you, except on the solution which you bring, we can arrive at this denigration, limit insults?
What is your problem? Too Much Druggs?

Daetren wrote:I'm pretty sure it's you who doesn't understand the current state. My point is pretty clear.

It's true that a player so much "Beautiful / Good?" than you, who has never had to manage a server, who returns after 1 month (2 months?) absence and complains about the current state of server must have a much more consistent opinion than a guy like me who had taken a GameMaster job (especially to handle a period of low population on my old server) and who plays every day 12/16 hours, without leaving elsewhere.

You won the Nobel Prize for absurdity! Even in alliance a lot of people do not go in your direction ... All Idiots?

So be it! AMEN!!!

Try to be smart once in a while, and accept that there is not one but many visions of the game, most of which you totally escape.

Do not continue the war on the Forum, it is useless and it will not raise your popularity rating!

I made my point, and you made yours. move on. stop wasting my time in and out of the game.

Guys, guys, please don't fight. You are both pillars of the mid community and we all love you both. I know its like an immovable object meets an irresistible force here with you two, but ****** at each other privately please. I suppose /as if you have to but that wasn't pretty today and not good for morale. Certainly don't fight here, you know these alb poofters enjoy seeing us beat up on each other. You know the ones I mean, the ones who never rvr without 24, who don't set foot in the frontier without certainty of success, the ones who twink alts for bg's, the ones who sit in lyonesse all day and never get in the game but are always the loudest voices on how things should be changed...etc....poofters thru and thru. Don't give em the pleasure.

I'll give my two cents here and this is just my opinion; your opinions are both valid and good from different angles. The Herald is bad for the game. It allows people to sit afk at home, suddenly there's fire on the keep and its 2 clicks and a magic necklace ride...a 2 minute run later your group is shoving an axe up someone's arse. However, without it, action would be tremendously harder to find and it would take longer to do so; people have made clear that they don't have the 'time' to invest in that old 2001 dynamic and even fewer would play the game. The other place has made it even easier, and turned the game into a complete joke. The Herald being what it is, albs of course are spooked and play the dodge inc game because they can't stand up against Mids right now. You guys are very experienced and good at the game. And yea, Ist is right, if they would actually engage in open field fights more they would eventually start having more success as they practiced different techniques rather than just get slaughtered everytime.

@Albion...take a few words of advice from a notorious exploiter regarding the days activities.

Some people get mad when you try to help the enemy because a weak enemy is more rps. But these Mids are so good, if you don't up your game you will quit long before you can enjoy even the smallest semblance of success against them. You are missing your Veteran players, whereas many of the Mids are still here. So let me offer some observations...

You albs need a better intelligence network, scouts, infils, people in keeps...something I dunno. Maybe its a numbers issue but when you got a group and a half like you did at the end today you can afford to have one peel and watch your backs.

Wickedone...you are very predictable. After Beno, you guys went Renaris as expected. Next another mid and I were chatting and he called Hurbury sure enough that's where you went. I made it there to find the door open and barely made it back to Surs. Then you came Surs as expected. Up to this point and beyond no mids stirring anywhere and you have faced no opposition. We skirmish at Surs (THANK YOU SWELTER 2k for the RR5 fund) and you take the keep. Immediately I jump Emain and put my pets in the gate...because 3 days in a row you completely ignore Eras and Bold. Normally I would have run down to the other alb keeps, but i already know you are going for some reason to ignore them again. Sure enough 15 min later another mid in emain (note mids scouting and sharing intel) says scout running AMG...i run to the gate as my pets hit him.

He stun commander like he should and runs. Other mid messages me ROFL pets chased him all the way to APK and portal guards not helping him. I laugh and reach over to terminate the pets, but then they are blown up by the keeptake group on the pad. I /as that you guys are going to jump mid. Other mid watches you port and reports it. Still no mids stirring. You guys go Bled as expected and mids start to trickle out. Ist responds since it is his keep and dies, the lack of assistance from other mids may have prompted the drama in this thread. Anyway you guys take keep. So good for you, you knew you were spotted in Emain and you went elsewhere, GJ finally.

But then, a complete brain fart. I dunno if you were feeling your wheaties from killing Ist or what....maybe you were like we just killed one of midgards finest, we are invincible!!! I dunno...maybe you were emboldened because you hadn't seen mids except for me and Ist this whole time. You drive to the heart of Midgard and try for Avarkr? Come on...complete foolishness. You had to know there was certainly mids in Jamtland enroute to Bled that had stopped when you took the keep and that you would be spotted. Thus, a massacre at Avarkr. Now the mid gank group is running and have tasted blood. After bledmeer you should have high tailed it back to APK and jumped Emain and rolled to Ailinne or gone home for Eras/Bold.

So you just got rolled by the gank group, do you try something clever or pick a safer option? No you go for the keep closest to the Mid pad at Dun Crauchon. I'm two steps ahead of you and keep pets out of gate so you feel like you haven't been spotted. Mids are enroute before you even dropped the ram on outer. I blow up Oldsham killing archers on the walls, right there you should have known the gig was up. But you press forward, I saw you man the front battlements to face the /inc which was good (sort of) but why not just pull out front. The mid group is in action now, i'm in the keep and have reported you...you know they are coming fast. You could have fought in the open instead of in a half taken keep with guards spawning on you. In any case, your position and demeanor was reported to the inc group and they smash faced you anyway.

Now either everyone is logging, it was about that time. Or your backs were broken and demoralized....I know this sounds like I'm trying to teach you how to be better dodgers. I'm not encouraging the Dodge cause its bad for the game, just saying you need to start fighting mids on a more level footing, they are just that good. I give out intel, but believe me they don't need it, they are veterans and can easily work you harder than a hooker on nickel night without even trying. If you don't start getting your people more success in the field vs just taking keeps they will eventually become tired of playing.

Other tips...repairing doors is good but find someone selfless who will run around and fix doors behind the battlegroup. Or take all ur keeps in albion first, see if no one comes...fix all your doors. Right now, its a very obvious 10 minute buffer after a take when we know your sitting there doing doors. It allows for us to position for your next move. Be creative, use some strategy.

Pets in gates...good job finally leaving when you were spotted. There's other ways to deal....stop short of gate, have stealther open...aoe mez pet or single mez if its a BD commander (healers can be ignored)....slip through the gate and on about your business. Now the pet controller can still see this if they watch the pet window (the mez will show up) but it requires a lot of attention and can easily be overlooked. Be creative...ffs.

Continual blue walls of kills are fun for me and midgard but bad for the game. Mids cannot be asked nor expected to roll for you. You need to start being more clever and getting your people some kills.

@Hibs....very very poor timing on your daily attack on Ailinne. I hope it was because you didn't have numbers until that point to do it, in which case thats just the way the cookie crumbled. What it felt like to me was that you saw the albs taking keeps, you saw the blue wall wipe, and then you saw albs go to cruachon and felt like you would sneak Ailinne while both realms fighting there. Bad idea. One side was gonna win and then see you on Ailinne and come get you. Get out and get those keeps early, mids usually fart around while albs roll initially. If you have the people get your keeps early and then maybe you get some inc.

I regret everything

@Random for your @hibs
Hibs nowadays cant even build a fg of 50, mate, we're trying to get those logged in, interested in a little keep take, free range rvr being out of our reach being either FG+++ of albs or fighting a collection of Herra's of Mids finest.
So, far from us any real strategy as you described, but thanks I'm always in for a bit of learning...
/sarcasm off now (sorry couldnt resist)
I'll keep on trying to find a speeder even lvl 45 to run a small duo or three men around the realms, and i'll keep on trying to get people interested but getting steamedrolled on our non 50 and 50's RR2, might get boring to some...Hell i died 4 or 5 time to Ist (that I dearly like from my time in mid uth1&2) at DC the other day, untill I found a willing low level bard to give a hand and finally get his rpees but not everyone will want to keep being farmed as I do, so get on your alts and make it a bit more interesting or satisfy yourself of a 2 realm war for now
my2cents

Banael wrote:@Random for your @hibs
Hibs nowadays cant even build a fg of 50, mate, we're trying to get those logged in, interested in a little keep take, free range rvr being out of our reach being either FG+++ of albs or fighting a collection of Herra's of Mids finest.
So, far from us any real strategy as you described, but thanks I'm always in for a bit of learning...
/sarcasm off now (sorry couldnt resist)
I'll keep on trying to find a speeder even lvl 45 to run a small duo or three men around the realms, and i'll keep on trying to get people interested but getting steamedrolled on our non 50 and 50's RR2, might get boring to some...Hell i died 4 or 5 time to Ist (that I dearly like from my time in mid uth1&2) at DC the other day, untill I found a willing low level bard to give a hand and finally get his rpees but not everyone will want to keep being farmed as I do, so get on your alts and make it a bit more interesting or satisfy yourself of a 2 realm war for now
my2cents

I can take some saltiness from a hib, since its understandable. My rvr activities focus almost exclusively on albs, I really don't have much desire to mess with the hibs. That being said, I saw you guys had a relatively large group out the other day like 1fg+ from the spam I saw, and yea the mid gank group hit you several times....but let me ask...why didnt you work your keeps one by one? You take the two close in...then come out to DC? Of course those mids going to hit you there. I agree, getting killed over and over is not fun especially if you have no chance and/or are not learning anything. Why, knowing mid gank running in emain...did your leaders not port you to alb or mid? Sneak in, take a keep and hole up in it. Make the enemy come to you....if they don't oh well just log. Why does everyone always run to the keep right by the mid pad and wonder why they get rolled?

When albs come out its very predictable...mids know albs will take keeps one by one all day long till they get smooshed/caught. HIbs have the advantage of mids not expecting them to do anything but Scaith/Ailinne. Go do something unexpected. When you see albs on the move, knowing that mids will fart around awhile...go find those albs and hit them. When albs jump go steal beno from them and hole up. Put Spymistress to work scouting for you instead of ganking people....get a bead on albs and hit them from behind at a keep or something. I generally get kills from albs when they take keeps cause theres always a few low/new people with the usual suspects so you should be able to get kills off alb groups. You got plenty of invis who can scout for you...make something happen instead of wringing your hands at the big bad mids steamrolling you. Haven't seen many hibs out of their areas the past few days but last week hibs were rolling around 5 man all over ganking mids xping, got ran over myself in alb a couple times...get your rps that way.

Ninja a mid keep that's unclaimed and setup there for the session, run around gank dodens, gank wraiths, gank whatever you can find. Be a general PITA till mids come out and assault your keep. FFS people make ****** happen.

You said yourself you duo'd Ist with a bard, thats pretty impressive. Keep being creative and good things will happen! Little secret...albs don't know how to pan...they run by me so many times in Pennine it isn't funny. I'm always down to come over and skirmish with a few of you at a level 1 keep, but I usually don't come to buggy ass level 4 scaith where 3 rover groups hit you at once the minute you hit the bottom of the hill.

Banael wrote:@Random for your @hibs
Hibs nowadays cant even build a fg of 50, mate, we're trying to get those logged in, interested in a little keep take, free range rvr being out of our reach being either FG+++ of albs or fighting a collection of Herra's of Mids finest.
So, far from us any real strategy as you described, but thanks I'm always in for a bit of learning...
/sarcasm off now (sorry couldnt resist)
I'll keep on trying to find a speeder even lvl 45 to run a small duo or three men around the realms, and i'll keep on trying to get people interested but getting steamedrolled on our non 50 and 50's RR2, might get boring to some...Hell i died 4 or 5 time to Ist (that I dearly like from my time in mid uth1&2) at DC the other day, untill I found a willing low level bard to give a hand and finally get his rpees but not everyone will want to keep being farmed as I do, so get on your alts and make it a bit more interesting or satisfy yourself of a 2 realm war for now
my2cents

Maybe we should really consider that and check if the others stop to dodge every fight. I like the idea.

I mean, on the one hand, I really enjoy playing my Savage and would love to get it on at least RR9.
On the other hand, I can understand the other players who say, what should we try to do against "high RR" mids.
Since we are all in the same boat, maybe we should all take a little more consideration and put ourselves in the position of others instead of flaming each other.
Each of us really just wants to play the game. That the situation is currently as it is, is not primarily because of the players. I know everyone knows why this is how it is and does not need to be discussed further here. We can only hope that the developers do something to make it better.
In the meantime, we should make the best of it and maybe even just make it a little fairer.
For my part, I would have no problem with playing a RR2 Bersi or another twink until the situation may one day allow for something else. I think if everyone was ready, we could enjoy more exciting RVR again. I'll just suggest this today when there are enough people. Because I would like to continue playing here and I'm ready to do something for it.

I want to make one thing clear. I'm a pvper to the core. That said I enjoy tutoring people to become better fighters so I im turn get better fights. I try to convey through emotes, a bow from me is not sarcastic. I respect everyone's resolve to come out in the face of danger and prevail or die trying.
Hibs/Nelt I've truly enjoyed our fights lately, the solo/ duos, and the 6v6 the other day, really showed resolve and promise. I hope you guys only grow. I also beckon others to come back out and keep trying since this is why I play. I don't often ever run except from groups when I'm solo unless I'm feeling invincible. So ill 1v1,1v2, 2v2, etc and try to always keep Inc fair. The unfortunate part is when friends log on and everyone wants to be a part of the action. Fga are mostly meant for Romu/ keep takers. I've mentioned to the others I've felt bad even with fair numbers our RRs can be intimidating. Regardless ill do my best to keep numbers fair, thank you for your Inc and efforts in rvr Hibs!

Now Albs, GoL I admire your tenacity. You've come out consistently for some time now and I feel with all our fights you're finally catching on quite well. Schmekatz your new moc is working quite well! Wicked you stick me like Romu does and it's very frustrating, I appreciate you recognize the real threats! Haha but seriously you've all gotten much quicker throughout our skirmishes. One thing i must know, Allthore has an extremely slow reaction time and often makes me wonder if a bot.. either way youre growing and I'm happy to hear. I wish you'd roam more and not dodge. I always come out solo first you try and get a read on numbers. As I said before I try to make groups with proper balance for your groups so its not overkill but someone's as I said when you form groups everyone wants in. I will continue to foster any Inc I can to show action is not dead. Should you have requests feel free to reply here or pm me and I'll do anything I can to help in your efforts to rvr.

Please I beg all to keep fighting the good fight! Regardless of conditions I will always die on my feet than on my knees. Might and glory to those on the battlefield! Valhalla awaits us!

Again, well fought all and keep it up!

PS I don't think I've made many personal attacks on the forums so far so if we can keep this thread halfway civil. I rage easily too but im my efforts to combat the keep focusing I reached out. I don't mind a debate but some of these replies have no focus or filter. Get a grip please.

only morons write textwalls lol

Daetren wrote:I regret everything

As I told to Enna, tomorrow it will be forgotten.
However, I am not the scapegoat on whom you would have a right to let off steam. Bad day? Not my prob!
Especially if there is other way if you really have something to someone that spread it in the public square (chat alliance), you can send anyone.

That said, it's nothing happened, let's forget.