On the Uthgard herald is:

48 active scouts
78 active hunters
178 active rangers

I judge this as a minimum number of archers who have gained at least 1 realm point in the last 7 days. I didn't look into this because of the inordinate number of rangers hibs have right now, which has been repeatedly pointed out in numerous threads for the last few weeks (without reason in my opinion, rangers are not that strong...). I looked into this because I almost never see scouts. Whatever happened to scouts after the volley nerf? I used to see them everywhere!

@Seyha: I found a picture of that 1v8 Ronia battle you mentioned

Well the scout not having buffs on a non buffbot server is right off the bat not that attractive to the new coming looking to start an archer. And also being that the scout isnt the greatest for melee, and since bow dmg isnt all that great, the scout just doesnt work out well on uthgard.

Now the hunter has buffs, and a better weapon, but there pet has been reported to not be preforming as well as it should, and also that 2h dmg has been reported to not be preforming as well as it should, so that could be affecting there melee.

Then you got the ranger, who has buffs, dual wielding melee and tons of posts online on the forums by those who has been killed by rangers, basicly saying the ranger is the best choice for archer. Even though the above explains why there is oviously going to be more rangers, which in turn more ranger kill experiences compared to scout and hunters. Also look at live, the ranger was a popular choice also.

Its easy to say the ranger is more popular and or OP, when compared to two other archers who under preform because of weak bow dmg and or 2h dmg and other related bugs. Some would rather nerf the ranger to bring in balance, instead of bringing the other two into balance by making those fixes.

Even if archers were completly fixed on uthgard and would peform like live pre toa, the ranger would be the only archer class capable of winning against assassins.

Scout and hunter have massive problems against assassins with evade 7, lacking melee damage and halfed defense. I know this, because I played a scout on live pre toa. Only after the release of toa (and forcefull zephyr), it was possible to defeat an assassin for scout/hunters when starting from melee. Before (espacially with the old RAs) a fight scout against assassin starting in melee was an easy win for the assassin. I even tried full melee (50 thrust with 9 sec dragonfang) and high dodger but even with IP and purge up, assassins won the most fights easly.

So, when you want to play a stealth class successfully, the only choise is to play an assassin or a ranger. The Uthgard rules (no buffbots, time decreased buff potions and charged) increase the problem. This is not a fault of the ranger, but a fault of the bad concept of scout and hunter as well as evade and defense halfing dual wield.

Astealoth wrote:On the Uthgard herald is:
48 active scouts
78 active hunters
178 active rangers

these numbers are off, because in BG hunters and scouts are fun. these classes get unattractive as soon as they are lvl50.

numbers of lvl50 with more than one lwrp:
hunters 18 - avg. 22k lwrp
scouts 12 - avg. 10k lwrp
rangers 71 - avg. 29k lwrp

I think with those numbers he meant accross ALL levels

Garad wrote:So, when you want to play a stealth class successfully, the only choise is to play an assassin or a ranger. The Uthgard rules (no buffbots, time decreased buff potions and charged) increase the problem. This is not a fault of the ranger, but a fault of the bad concept of scout and hunter as well as evade and defense halfing dual wield.

This is what "classic" is all about.

Nah that's what uthgard is about. On classic my scout had a buffbot and I did fairly well with it

Toblerone wrote:Nah that's what uthgard is about. On classic my scout had a buffbot and I did fairly well with it

Well Mythic patchs was done with the buff bot population on mind, over and over, we are no live like for that, its a problem, and mixing new ras (designed for bot and toa) and utghard...

Garad wrote:Even if archers were completly fixed on uthgard and would peform like live pre toa, the ranger would be the only archer class capable of winning against assassins.

Scout and hunter have massive problems against assassins with evade 7, lacking melee damage and halfed defense. I know this, because I played a scout on live pre toa. Only after the release of toa (and forcefull zephyr), it was possible to defeat an assassin for scout/hunters when starting from melee. Before (espacially with the old RAs) a fight scout against assassin starting in melee was an easy win for the assassin. I even tried full melee (50 thrust with 9 sec dragonfang) and high dodger but even with IP and purge up, assassins won the most fights easly.

So, when you want to play a stealth class successfully, the only choise is to play an assassin or a ranger. The Uthgard rules (no buffbots, time decreased buff potions and charged) increase the problem. This is not a fault of the ranger, but a fault of the bad concept of scout and hunter as well as evade and defense halfing dual wield.

I totally agree, on top of that what stops a scout from using a dext/quic buff str/con buff etc...? also slam can help sometimes also if your target doesnt have purge up , and doing a crit shot in his face will hurt anyway, melee dmg will be gimp but the block helps, i had problems with scouts blocking me so much that stun timer passed and they slamed again.

zaszeadora wrote:Well Mythic patchs was done with the buff bot population on mind, over and over, we are no live like for that, its a problem, and mixing new ras (designed for bot and toa) and utghard...

But they had buff bots in OF too...

Lets just make our own patches/RA system the way we think they should be because the very concept of live revolved around buff bots!

Braxis wrote:

zaszeadora wrote:Well Mythic patchs was done with the buff bot population on mind, over and over, we are no live like for that, its a problem, and mixing new ras (designed for bot and toa) and utghard...

But they had buff bots in OF too...

Lets just make our own patches/RA system the way we think they should be because the very concept of live revolved around buff bots!

Sorry was a mistake on phrase build, i mean that Clasees was patched over an over on live thinking about toa and bots, we cant do that( i love a non buff bot server) but we have some imbalances like rangers for example, or underperform of scouts/hunters cause of that.

Two of the highest rr scouts felt the need to reroll to infi's because scouts suck here, that kinda gives you an indicator

And don't come here with your : just use pots/charges, because everyone does.. anyone who doesn't is just free rp anyway.

Simple fact is that Scout/Hunters underperform like mad here and ontop of that they usually get zerged down by the hib stealth zerg (unless they run part of a stealth grp, but then everyone QQ's at them)

i want no one be fooled, maybe in the bg are fun because people do not purge and sometimes you can have 1vs1, but in Emain, the ranger / ns are never alone all have purge and the slam is useless, I've just despair if you want to run alone.


pd: make a Ranger, if you want an archer, the best damage with bow, themselves bufs (not wasting time and money crafting), rr5 root and make 200-300 damage and u have speed to kite, and in mele.. hig damage.
Ah, if u want st duo, ns/ranger, ranger make stun and ns pa, if he purge use rr5 and ns make pa ^^

Hm... thats not right i always try to play solo and some another player too but sometimes hibs/albs/mids come with stealth zerg at the beginn and they dont know how much incs are out but thats why everyone zergs and btw Ministrel/infi in duo is much harder to kill as a ranger ns duo ^^ . And Hunter/Sb duo is nice to you just have to know how to play chose the right Ras and you can have fun too .And much Ranger here have some another toons too but they prefer play a stealther cause they get farmed solo from a fg if they try to get to ermain .

Neju wrote:Two of the highest rr scouts felt the need to reroll to infi's because scouts suck here, that kinda gives you an indicator

And don't come here with your : just use pots/charges, because everyone does.. anyone who doesn't is just free rp anyway.

Simple fact is that Scout/Hunters underperform like mad here and ontop of that they usually get zerged down by the hib stealth zerg (unless they run part of a stealth grp, but then everyone QQ's at them)

You dont play a stealther yourself? Yeah, Black Adders know how to play solo... They played their archers most of the time unstealthed with mos5 and sticked to the mincer and slam and on closest range volley assist of 3 guys. Thats how they played their archer.

There is only ONE good scout on Uthgard and he won yesterday vs me because of 20 blocks 5 evades. Must be 50 shields and high moblock. Thanks to the too high chance of destealth while drawing critshot with 50 stealth...

My advice dont spec one hand weapon. Only shields and bow as a scout. On the other hand nice that infis make almost the same damage with 3.3 stiletto like a nightshade with 4.2 blades.

@Syu
Yep, Inf+Minstrel is the hardest stealth combo. Good damage with DDs +viper3 and pd is pretty useless. Why ppl always complain about PD, block or parry is much better because you dont get any damage at all.
Also dont forget about the pretty OP RA am2-3, if you dont hit the mincer you dont any make damage at all to the lifebar of the inf.