Gil wrote:I'm sure it's true that a lot of folks have given up and moved on (or back) to another game. But that's not unique to Uthgard. Every MMO has that issue. People try a game for a few hours or days and then drift away. I recall a study that showed that a SUCESSFUL MMO would retain ~ 30% of it's players after the first month. So, it's to be expected that ~ 70% of those who try the game won't stay.

And yet, Uthgard needs a sizable population to be fun. Here, the other players are our targets. If we don't have enough targets we'll all stop playing. Is there any hope? Sure, new players keep starting the game. Some of them will like it and stay active for a while. As long as enough new players come in to replace those moving away, the game will do well.

Now, the question might be asked, 'What tweaks could the staff do to increase the player retention rate?'. Would some of the QoL changes to make the game more friendly to new players keep them playing longer? It MIGHT but too many changes to make the game easier will drive some of the hardcore players away. So, it isn't easy to know which QoL changes will retain more players than they drive away.

I agree with what you say, however, Uthgard's vision is at odds with keeping a sizable community. They would have to be willing to budge on small changes, which they've shown clearly they are not.

Uthgard 2 is pretty much Uthgard 1 minus some nice features.

There are many new players to Uthgard who came from live, with no clue what 1.65 would actually mean to them, and most of them have come to realise that its not what they expected or remembered from "back in the day".

A lot of these people have given up; so on the whole the people who remain are the same bunch who were here for Uth1 and their play style hasn't changed. They still want the 8v8 with their guild groups and don't particularly care about BG's, PvE, Casuals, Solos unless it directly affects their arena plays.

I loved Uthgard1's BGs (before they broke them by making them patch correct :/) because it allowed the small mans, solos and Pvers somewhere to go where they weren't steamrolled. However, allowing players to stay in BGs permanently is a bad idea.

The idea of getting a 1.5x RP reward for defending and a 1.2x RP reward for attacking a defended keep i think would be a great idea.

I personally only ever duo casually, and the frontiers is basically a dead zone to me with the 'read is dead even if you're grey' mentality.

Recently Thid has been very good for action albeit with the alb zerg owning and hiding in the Ck for easy noob farming.

Read most of this thread... Useless when most of the people who are against bonuses are those still playing. We need to hear from people who have actually stopped playing.
If I recall right... When the keep bonuses were removed or reduced on uthgard 1.0 the overall RvR action died down. The keep take rps and tasks may have been abused but I am pretty certain it resulted in more RvR action in the frontier. In fact most of the late changes relating to RvR (keeps and potions etc) were counter productive in helping the server. The hardcore players have always whined about about this because they don't deem this a worthy way to RVR, then cry when there was no action. Have to look at the bigger picture... I would bet that introducing some sort of rp bonuses and visual upgrades (armor padding and weapon skins and effects) using bounty points will immediately increase RvR activity and on uthgard 2.0, with its high population, will less likely be abused because there are so many more people just waiting to join the RvR fun. It was mostly abused on Uthgard 1.0 because there was barely anyone around to stop it from being abused.

Age832 wrote:Read most of this thread... Useless when most of the people who are against bonuses are those still playing. We need to hear from people who have actually stopped playing.
If I recall right... When the keep bonuses were removed or reduced on uthgard 1.0 the overall RvR action died down. The keep take rps and tasks may have been abused but I am pretty certain it resulted in more RvR action in the frontier. In fact most of the late changes relating to RvR (keeps and potions etc) were counter productive in helping the server. The hardcore players have always whined about about this because they don't deem this a worthy way to RVR, then cry when there was no action. Have to look at the bigger picture... I would bet that introducing some sort of rp bonuses and visual upgrades (armor padding and weapon skins and effects) using bounty points will immediately increase RvR activity and on uthgard 2.0, with its high population, will less likely be abused because there are so many more people just waiting to join the RvR fun. It was mostly abused on Uthgard 1.0 because there was barely anyone around to stop it from being abused.

THIS

Blue, please read

Wulver wrote:

Vlalkor wrote:You do get rewards for taking keeps. Extra dmg and rps.

Yeah, having more keeps means you will defend them for these bonuses, and you get DF.

tell that to Alb lol. To them there might as well not even be any Keeps

Go out and earn your rp's like everyone else. No free rp's from keeps. Kill crafters lol. Sarcasm

But seriously keeps should give some rp's. It encourages different playstyles. Remember Trishin saying they try to encourage different playstyles. It's hard to tell.

Rewards will get abused.
Warhammer Online had the same problem, people even ignored each other and only went for the keeps.

Wraex wrote:Rewards will get abused.
Warhammer Online had the same problem, people even ignored each other and only went for the keeps.

I don't see anything wrong with that if the reward is only minor. To "abuse" 250 rps per keep you'd need over 2000 keep takes to get to RR5. Doesn't seem unreasonable to me.

All this keep taking would certainly see action flourish in the frontiers.


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RvR is about killing ppl, not doors or lords...

If RvR task and Realmpoints for keeps come back ill quit i guess - never liked that concept

Itz wrote:RvR is about killing ppl, not doors or lords...

If RvR task and Realmpoints for keeps come back ill quit i guess - never liked that concept

The very WORDS: Realm vs Realm says to me that Realm guards and keep Lords ARE realm enemies. Therefore I think we should be rewarded for killing guards and lords. Not as much as for killing players true. IMO, player killing is a subset of RvR.

TLDR: This is an RvR game not JUST PvP.

[EDIT] BTW, we had this discussion 5 years ago: viewtopic.php?f=32&t=26541

Preach it Gil.

The consequence of keeps giving a small reward is more people spending time in the frontiers. Seems good to me.

Edit: typo

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Itz wrote:RvR is about killing ppl, not doors or lords...

If RvR task and Realmpoints for keeps come back ill quit i guess - never liked that concept

As Barto and others have pointed out, the benefit outweighs the negative. And as for quitting--what an exaggeration. You would be so outraged by the idea of people making petty realmpoints, meanwhile broadcasting their location and making it easy to find action?

Methinks you're being insincere.

Isavyr wrote:

Itz wrote:RvR is about killing ppl, not doors or lords...

If RvR task and Realmpoints for keeps come back ill quit i guess - never liked that concept

As Barto and others have pointed out, the benefit outweighs the negative. And as for quitting--what an exaggeration. You would be so outraged by the idea of people making petty realmpoints, meanwhile broadcasting their location and making it easy to find action?

Methinks you're being insincere.

If people need a reward other then DF and XP/RP bonuses to take keeps and claim then idk.
I dont see one benefit where ppl get RP Rewards for pveing, what about mobs giving RPs? Just name them Midgard Invader and there you go =)

double post

Itz wrote:

Isavyr wrote:

Itz wrote:RvR is about killing ppl, not doors or lords...

If RvR task and Realmpoints for keeps come back ill quit i guess - never liked that concept

As Barto and others have pointed out, the benefit outweighs the negative. And as for quitting--what an exaggeration. You would be so outraged by the idea of people making petty realmpoints, meanwhile broadcasting their location and making it easy to find action?

Methinks you're being insincere.

If people need a reward other then DF and XP/RP bonuses to take keeps and claim then idk.
I dont see one benefit where ppl get RP Rewards for pveing, what about mobs giving RPs? Just name them Midgard Invader and there you go =)

You must not have played on Live DAoC then, because the frontiers were packed with people taking AND defending keeps all the time, and yes RPS were rewarded for taking keeps. My Eld that hit a very high RR both through 8 manning and bombing zergs could make 20-30k defending a keep vs an Alb zerg, so ummm what are you talking about that "you cant make rps at keeps" , of course you can, but only if the keeps are worth being attacked in the first place. Here on Uthgard unfortunately, Keep action is dead and it eliminates a large portion of what makes RvR, well RvR