Glacius wrote:

boba wrote:
Spamming doublefrost doesn't really help against pd5.

What do you want me to do, cast him to death??:))))))))) ofc i tried after evades if i got one and used dmg add charges and so on, side stun like you i dont have,but i still kick ass:P..apart from that what do you expect a zerker to do in your opinion? , but still..having 1750 weap skil and hiting him for 90(-100) dmg..while he does 80 dmg on me also takes the ****** you know:P

There is a nice style called aurora borealis, it has a proc. That proc is cold damage. Landing a 3rd style in a chain is not that big of a problem against ranger since his only defense is evade3 plus rangers don't get advanced evade so when you get behind them they loose their only defense.

Oh sorry, strafing is not "honorable" or whatever. Obviously everyone can do it cause it's super easy but they don't cause they are "honorable".

Nixian, thank you for your compliments, but with the change to crit shot my play style is ruined. Yes, I agree that it was OP for archers to crit any time but as a Hunter that was the only way I could keep up with other classes in damage (combined with Volley).

I'm respecing to Sword out of desperation but haven't been able to finish my new SC, so I've gone inactive.

Old Frontiers will really hurt Hunters not only because of the loss of MoS but losing our RR5 as well. The Hunter RR5 is really good, even better than the Ranger RR5 in most situations. Without MoS and RR5 the Hunter will be food for all stealthers.

Currently assassins and Scouts are the only classes I can beat frequently. Assassins are easy--90% of assassin players are awful. I go to AMG with MoS 4 and CAMO UP, wait for a solo assassins, Crit Shot --> Rapid Fire or Volley and then go afk for 10 minutes until CAMO is back up. Easy RPs.

I can beat a lot of classes if I kite like mad and have all my RAs up, but this is a pathetic way of playing and it only works if my opponent is stupid enough to let me kite him in the first place.

How to fix the Hunter? I have already provided proof in patch notes that Hunter melee damage growth should be 'high'. Currently Hunters base melee damage is about 6% higher than the Scout and Ranger. That's pathetic when you consider the massive damage difference between Dual-Wield and Spear. Spear is the worst melee setup in the game. Terrible damage, defense penalties on any-time styles, and SLOW. Who cares about the back stun? What kind of noob will let a Hunter run through him to back stun? You would have to be asleep to let that happen. A side-stun is much easier to land.

A boost to Hunter melee damage would not be custom because there are patch notes to prove that the Hunter received a significant boost to melee damage over other archer classes.

Seyha wrote:A side-stun is much easier to land.

Belive me when I say, no. Sure side style is easier to land on a dumb opponent, on a one that tries to avoid it it's much harder to land a side style then it is a backstyle.

Thanks Seyha for the input. Now that an actual hunter that was named in this post has agreed on what ive posted from the start what do you have to say now Nixian? The crit shot change totally killed hunters and forces them to melee. PLUS if you read Seyha's post you literally have to wait 10 mins between kills for camo to come up to do anything. Sounds fun huh? But I guess your closed minded thinking will not change. Owell, I tried Hunters. I really tried!

A boost to Hunter melee damage would not be custom because there are patch notes to prove that the Hunter received a significant boost to melee damage over other archer classes.

afaik we had that discussion and you were already told u had a boost in dmg compared to rangers / scouts so why bring this up again?


and devil the critshot change was for all archers - also scouts and rangers..

and tbh scouts aint that OP in melee .. you should try play one.. they don't really wanna get into a melee fight 1v1.. they would rather hit u with volley from miles away I bet..


devilsfury custom changes are bad.. learn to live with your character and start bugging staff for a critshot fix instead of QQing about hunters specificly then I might not be after you as i am atm


and I am not close minded.. you should ask my friends and find out who you are talking to before you make such assumptions


now... back to owning hunters who thinks "shoot shoot spear" is the way to own me

Hey Nixian, how about putting in a good word for us hunters about putting Crit shot back into game like it use to be???

nixian
Moderator

I have no jurisdiction in those areas.. im just a simple mod trying to keep this forum clean


less offtopic - if you wanna discuss critshot open a new thread in bug report section explaining what is wrong about critshot, how it should be, and possibly tests or video or SSs or any other evidence from live that that is how it is supposed to work

nixian wrote:

A boost to Hunter melee damage would not be custom because there are patch notes to prove that the Hunter received a significant boost to melee damage over other archer classes.

afaik we had that discussion and you were already told u had a boost in dmg compared to rangers / scouts so why bring this up again?

My point is that the difference in damage for Hunters is not enough to compensate for the superior mechanics of dual wield, or even the extra defense and stun of shield. Scouts will be great when purge is on a 30 minute timer.

devilsfury, there is no need to be disrespectful to our fellow players, but I do understand your frustration.

People who say that Hunter damage is 'fine' or that we should learn to play the class we have chosen should looks at the Hunter objectively and ask, "What is the point of this class?"

Here are the facts about the Hunter:

--A melee Hunter does less DPS than a hybrid spec Ranger. I guarantee this. A melee spec Ranger will absolutely crush a melee spec Hunter. There is no comparison.

--The Scout has its own problems, but it has good defense and utility with shield and better bow damage, which makes it much better for stealth groups and keep sieges than the Hunter.

--The Hunter has the weakest bow ability of the Archer classes. Even though the Ranger is much better in melee, they still get better bows than the Hunter. The Scout has better defense and 9s stun, and better bows. How does this make sense? Where does the Hunter fit in?

--Blue has said that the Hunter pet's melee damage is low because of balancing problems with mobs on Uthgard. A member of the staff has confirmed that the Hunter pet is not doing the damage that it should do.

So what is the point of the Hunter? What is the Hunter 'good' at? The pet is a minor annoyance. The Hunter's melee setup is the worst of any hybrid in the game--the WORST. The Hunter has the WORST bow ability of the archer classes.

The Hunter is supposed to be the close range, melee specialist of the archer classes. This is NOT the case on Uthgard.

What are you people asking for?
Do you really want a custom Hunter push on Uthgard?
Like maybe give him evade 5 and +20% damage on Bow and Melee?
So maybe the Hunter is the weakest of all Stealthers, but one class HAS to be the weakest and its pretty much live like.

(My mentalism Mentalist sucks at doing damage and loses all 1v1, btw. The Necromancer is not even implemented, the Bonedancer is missing Pets, The Animist is missing Spells, Albion and Hibernia don't get the 9% Abs Buff because of that. And all to implement all that would be livelike and not implementing custom love for one class.)

But Critshot change is silly, i agree, it worked fine before (Sorry Nixian).

Gerbald wrote:What are you people asking for?
(My mentalism Mentalist sucks at doing damage and loses all 1v1, btw.

Why are you comparing 1v1 of a support/caster class to a stealth/archer class? How about we compare group invites for Mentalist vs. Hunter?

Hunters should receive a 10-15% increase in melee damage growth (weaponskill?) to be competitive. The Hunter pet's damage should be increased by 30-40%. This is not custom--there are patch notes (pre-1.80) that mention a significant Hunter melee damage boost to make the class competitive. The staff have said that Hunter pet damage is lower than it should be because of how mobs are implemented on Uthgard.

Seyha wrote: The staff have said that Hunter pet damage is lower than it should be because of how mobs are implemented on Uthgard.

so we have a mob bug and not a hunter bug go report

Do you really want a custom Hunter push on Uthgard?
Like maybe give him evade 5 and +20% damage on Bow and Melee?
So maybe the Hunter is the weakest of all Stealthers, but one class HAS to be the weakest and its pretty much live like.

pretty much sums up my points on this subject

But Critshot change is silly, i agree, it worked fine before (Sorry Nixian).

I actually agreed to this and said they should go report it? fail to see why ur sorry so you dont have to be be happy

nixian wrote:

Seyha wrote: The staff have said that Hunter pet damage is lower than it should be because of how mobs are implemented on Uthgard.

so we have a mob bug and not a hunter bug go report

Blue is aware of the problem.

No Hunter is asking for 20% increase in damage or Evade 5. Myself and the other Hunter players here have explained the problems with the class in detail. I have offered a solution based on Mythic's own patch notes.

http://support.darkageofcamelot.com/kb/ ... php?id=569

We've decided to make Hunters more effective in Melee combat. These changes will help them greatly in both PvE as well as RvR:

- All Hunter melee skills base damages have been increased "behind the scenes". The specific melee skills involved are sword and spear. Hunters will now notice that they do more damage every time they attack an opponent with these weapon types. Hunters now do more base damage than the other two Archer classes, and will not need to do anything to take advantage of this change - it will happen automatically every time they hit with a weapon.

"These changes will help them greatly in both PvE as well as RvR"

The Hunter does not have a "great" difference in base melee damage over the Ranger, or even the Scout when you factor in the boost to damage from defense and utility. I believe the staff have confirmed the difference is about 6%.

imo 6% extra dmg is a significant boost compared to rangers/scouts?


and blue can't fix mob dmg unless someone go test how much monsters should hit for on cloth, chain, etc. from lvl 1-50 with grey,green, blue, yellow, oj, red, purple mobs at all lvls... so go ahead and test and report

@Seyha

Most mobs on Uthgard do less damage than on live so do pets.
I think the advantages of the hunter is the ability to use twohanded weapons like spear (thrust) or sword (slash) and his pet, but pets suck on Uthgard this is one step back.

Will test some things with my hunter if I downloaded DAoC.

nixian wrote:imo 6% extra dmg is a significant boost compared to rangers/scouts?
report

Nixian, you are a good enough player to know there is more to how much damage a class does than just weapon skill or "base damage." You need to compare style lines, self-buffs, utility (stuns), and defense.

Most Rangers hit me for between 80-120 on the mainhand and about 25-40 on the off hand. The swing speed is usually about 2 seconds.

I hit for about 150-220 with a 3.4 second swing speed (39+15 Spear spec). To do this kind of damage I must use the taunt style Engage (medium defense penalty). I can use Lancer but the style growth is poor and it also has a defense penalty (!). My pet does 20-30 damage, with a 75% miss rate against level 50 players (!) at normal mob attack speed (about 3.4 seconds).

As you can see, when you factor in the speed of the attacks the Ranger is already doing much more damage than the Hunter. Plus he has the advantage of a fast attack, allowing him to land reactionary styles easily against my slow Hunter. Slow weapon speed is a major disadvantage for a low defense class like the Hunter!

Now factor in the Ranger's damage add. So he does 80-120 + 20 and 25-40 + 20 damage respectively. Now factor in the chance to proc with two weapons. Now factor in the chance to proc is even higher since the Ranger is swinging much faster (more attacks = more chances to Proc). Now factor in criticals on the off-hand.

We are looking at a 30-40% damage superiority for a Ranger over a Hunter in melee. The Ranger already has better bows with longer range, so there is no comparison there.

Assassins vs. Hunter? Ok, just replace the Ranger's damage add with DoTs and STR/CON debuff.

So where did the Hunter's 6% damage "advantage" go? It is worthless because of all the other factors in melee combat.

@Razzer

Thank you for offering to test mobs. That would be very helpful. Being able to swap damage types on Spear is nice.