About some players's RvR behaviour.
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and it has been like that for years...
this tells a lot, organized fights, others not welcome to play while those 16 claim most part of agra.... and then you find it weird lvl 50 players leave the server or choose not to do rvr? |
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i´m speaking just for myself. Played here in uth. about 1,5 years.
Topic is about ppls rvr behaviour. Maybe most ppl reading this topic are the guys playing in agramon, so what 
I think most ppl in BGs are kind, because it´s playfully there. Other points for me in playing only BG  I don´t want to have trouble in playing at agramon instead of having fun.
I´m sick about flaming, progaming, useless running without incs, long preparing for battle.
I want a fair chance to win some battles.
I want to get an inviting (i usualy get instant invites even for hunter in BGs(!))
I want test out new classes
Sometimes i want to do PvE with nice ppl
even questing or events could be funny
I don´t want to have the feeling all ppl around me are rp junkies
conclusion: better to be a gimp, noob or adder in BGs than get ganked, flamed, kicked in NF. BTW: RPs poisons the mind of ppl. substitute rps with points for gaining reskins or whatever! |
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And everyone becomes a running lightbulb once more. |
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Lightbulbs having fun > frustrated grey mice
Anyway: problems will go away with many more people. Why arent there more? Cause its frickin hard to get to 50. Yes, I do have more than one lvl 50, but with so few people on, I like to be flexible which class I play. Let the live servers go down and we will have more than enough people in rvr. Changing human behaviour? Not going to happen unless we kick people. Which should not be the solution imo. I just live with the situation. Got enough friends here, so I get dragged along although I am far from being uber. Or even good. |
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The funny thing is, that in Emain we didnt have that problem as far as i remember.
Maybe Agramon itself is the Problem^^ In Emain it was a lot easier for solos or small groups. There were much more places to hide like the trees the bridges the water ect., enough place to escape, without running into mobs you could see early when and how many enemies were heading in your direction and still had a chance to get away. In Agramon only a few ppl run out solo or in duo or so. Maybe its just the zone with all these hills ...you run around and all of a sudden a fg jumps on you and you dont even know were they came from. Some solos or small grp´s really manage to win, maybe just because they play really good, others dont and die over and over ,or add (dont matter) and usually get the prompt response in /broad ... wich is just as nessasary as the pope´s balls ! A lot of ppl dont have problems looking with the camera up,down and in all directions at the same time. But a lot do, counting myself (i know i am gimp)^^ But thats for me a reason not to run solo in Agramon for example . Maybe this sounds offtopic but its not. I think thats one of the roots here. |
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I think these viewpoints from a couple of posters here cover a majority of the concerns of the types of players that benifit to the server. :
Ill repost most of my original points of discussion about what I feel uthgard can improve on to remedy this situation. I will respond to several of the points some other people posted here and finally tie all of these issues together. Issues I brought up in previous posts: 1. realm population imbalances 2. realm rank imbalances 3. attraction of new players Player quotes:
My response I agree with the sentiments with these people on a wide range of points they make. I'll quote some of the key points made and comment on each. 1. I don´t want to have trouble in playing at agramon instead of having fun. 2. I want a fair chance to win some battles - 3. Why arent there more? Cause its frickin hard to get to 50. 4. Problems will go away with many more people. Points I & II Dealing with the issue of fair play & excessive frustrations I think these points illustrate situations that are intertwined with one another, and of which i've commented on previously. There are simply too many frustrating factors involved with the level 50 rvr zone, especially in regard to the great disparity between low realm rank players and high realm ranked players. People are far less inclined to participate in a fight where they know they have no chance and no real reward, especially considering low realm ranked players are going to be disproportionately in pick up groups consisting of new players, or (fun only) players. One of the reasons People remain in the bgs is as the person mentioned, they know they have a fair chance. I believe some measures need to be included to offer tangible incentives for these types of players to stay involved in rvr. For example, offering RP bonuses on a scaling basis for players of low realm rank when they kill or participate iin the killing of a high realm ranked player. As an exampe, a rr2 player participating in the killing of a rr9 player gets 5x the normal rp for his part in killing that player. I assume normally, a player would get some marginal amount of rps for their part (how much damage they did). The idea here is to add a bonus multiplier to that amount so if a player got 30 rps for being a part of a kill, then that rr2 player would now get 150. A rr4 player participating in the killing of the same rr9 player gets 3x normal rps. We could have the scaling process clamped at say, realm rank 5 by which after this has been met no more additional bonuses are given for attacking a person of higher realm rank to prevent exploitation. Simply put, this gives lower ranked players at least some reason to stay out there. Furthermore we could make it so that players realm rank 5:l1 or higher higher get less exp for killing a player below say realm rank 5. For example a realm rank 9 player killing a realm rank 1 player may only get 25% of normal rps. A realm rank 2 opponent would give the realm rank 9 player 45% and so on. This would give lower ranked players an incentive to continue participating knowing that they wont be 'farmed' for much gain so to speak. Ideally i'd like to not see anyone being penalised, however I do believe that adding bonuses to the lower ranked players is a way to proceed with offering valuable incentives. A second aspect to these two issues that the posters brought up are the lack of viability of pick up groups. I think some people really dread at the prospects of joining pick up groups and there is good reason to. The cohesiveness in a PUG is bad enough as it is without adding in factors like 'being farmed" by higher rr players, or having bad leaders and group communication. I think adding incentives for low realm ranked players to remain grouped and going back out there as opposed to being frustrated and logging off is a good thing. Incentives could be something like a group RP bonus earned if all members of the group are of a certain realm rank or below. For example if everyone within a group of players is realm rank 4L9 or below then they get a bonus to their combined group RPs (possibly also in addition to their individual bonuses listed above) if they kill players of a higher realm rank they they are. This bonus could be something to the effect of 25-50% increase in rp gain by the group participating in a kill. Groups of less than 4 individuals probably should not get these bonuses. I think this would encourage people to remain grouped, and continue participating. For example a group of players who are all realm rank 2 fighting a group of realm rank 9 players. The realm rank 2 group would get the exp bonus (lets say 50% in this case) due to their targets that they attacked being of higher realm rank than they are. If the group would normally have gotten 100 points for participating in killing members of that group, under the group bonus, they now get 150. Again, this bonus would only apply to involvement in killing players of a certain rank or higher. Point III The problem of character progression & realm population imbalances Character progression: I think that this is a key issue and should not be underestimated in its affect and importance to new players and players that are here to 'have fun.' I believe that this is one of the number one reasons why individuals choose to not stick with uthgard once starting here in addition to adding to a focus on BG's as goals. I think it is safe to say that as a general rule, people dislike certain kinds of character progression, and experience gain definitely ranks up there. As it stands now, experience gain on uthgard is a tedious process with very few reasons for new players in particular, to remain and stick with the server. I believe this goes back to the core reasons why people play freeshards to begin with, being that they aren't 'live like' in every aspect. Simply put, server administrators can dynamically change their servers to reflect their own goals, agendas as well as that of their community, should they choose to involve their community in this process. I believe uthgard can use more imaginative and substantive methods to encourage individuals to progress their characters to level 50 participation in rvr and to disencourage sticking to BG's as sources of entertainment. I've already propose a number of measures that could be taken HERE. I think offering new players in particular, options as proposed in that thread linked above are some of the measures the staff could take to add incentives for people to remain on the server, level their chars, leave the bgs and then finally participate in level 50 rvr. Setting goals for people to achieve and then setting options up for them to choose from is the point of my proposal. People like having options and people also like having rewards. The choices I am proposing allow people to have make a decision on how they want to progress their character, gives them a boost if they choose a particular path/reward and importantly, it lessons the feeling that they are 'grinding to no forseeable and reachable goal. I do not believe in free-handouts so to speak, and as such, my proposal clearly indicates that the person must give up something in order to progress their character. In this case, they give up access to the bgs if they choose to accept rewards. The type of reward they choose fundementalyl decides their path on uthgard such as choosing RP vouchers to offer incentives to get to level 50 and use this, or obtaining an item or exp bonuses for choosing to not stay in or use a bg. All of these can be used to steer people into participating in the level 50 rvr zone. As an example of how including experience bonuses can steer individuals into participation we can look at my previous points I & II where people may know they will receive rp bonuses for grouping with other similar players at 50. Using a combination of approaches to solving this issue (use of tangible incentives in the level / char progression process and also rvr bonuses while at 50) then we can tackle this issue. If players know they are going to get a RP bonus through the use of their vouchers & through participating in the killing of higher realm ranked players then they are more inclined to level to 50 and remain active in lvl 50 rvr. Realm population imbalances The issue of realm population imbalances can be taken in context with the other previously mentioned issues in that it needs a wide assortment of tactics to use to combat it. I think it doesn't need to be said that players dont particularily enjoy playing on a realm with a low population, and in particularly when that realm is on the losing side of things. To combat this issue I propose a few things, namely the use of rp bonuses / penalties for players in the rvr zone, as well as the use of the Bonus/incentive system i proposed earlier as a means to combat level progression issues. I mentioned in a previous post in this thread about an idea of a dynamic RP bonus/penalty incentive for realms. I think using targeted bonuses to low population realms can offer incentives for people to play on those realms and remain there long enough to balance things out. For example, all realms should have access to level progression incentives as proposed in the above mentioned link but a low population realm may be given additional bonuses / items or a choice of all bonuses/items at once at each lvl/bg progression point. This would encourage people to join low population realms for speedier advancement and/or more bonuses. As an example, if midgard is considered a low population realm, then it could add the ability to choose both RP vouchers and EXP bonuses as rewards for opting out of BGs and getting to level 50. This would expedite the level progression of the players in that realm and would give them incentives to remain in lvl 50 events. Alterntively, the choice of rewards/bonuses could be kept the same for all realms but with the low population realm getting higher values to these bonuses. Using midgard again as an example, it could get a 10x exp gain reward for its low population as opposed to what other realms get (2x exp gain) and so forth. The exp (and other rewards) could be tweaked for alll realms so that the players see a clear benifit to choosing one side for participating in. In my opinion this allows the staff to better control of the population shifting as well as increasing involvement from individuals in the level 50 zones simply by making them more accessible by new players (and those what don't have a lot of time to invest). Point IV. Problems will go away with many more people. I think this is well put and really ties all of this together. Ultimately i feel that if the staff is proactive enough and uses at least some of these proposals in some form, that the dynamics of uthgard can change for the better. Through offering incentives for people to join the server and continue progressing their characters, the population of uthgard can grow exponentially. Additionally, solving the issues faced by people once they reach 50 will help with retention and keep people on the server and active in the level 50 events and zones. Resolving the realm imbalances will help to alleviate the social tension between individuals from different realms as well as increasing activity by all realm players as they have more confidence and incentive to participate in rvr. An increased and active rvr population means less of the same old faces running into one another and inciting negative responses. I feel that this problem IS solvable but it is going to require that the Staff get seriously involved with taking on these issues at once in a large and decisive manner. It is also going to require that players do their part by informing and assisting other players about any new actions that the staff decide upon so that people can take advantage of this. |
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Because then they realize what a heap of idiots they're dealing with. Might as well get the hell away from them. You can't cure cancer. It's seriously mind numbing to see the same tards spam the same ****** in broad eeeeeevvvvvvvvvvvvvery ssiiiiiiiiiiiiiingleeee tiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiime I appear or log on. "German german german adder german german -.-" "German adder german german add ^^" "XD" "lol" "xD" "XDDDD" |
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haha ur so right plz german guys .. don't talk german in public channels.. it just upsets people who doesn't understand german.. go to /gu or /chat if its soooo needed to talk german to the public (esp. when ur in agra, plz..) |
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Well, when I build a group, I think twice before I invite that Skald, which I know adds anyway. Even if I know he plays well and is nice to have in group. The more you add, the less you will be invited by people who like fair fights, just face it.
Very true. The easier it is to get to 50, the more people will be in Agramon, the less you will hear about add or no add.
Hahaha.
No, I don't. Did I say that?
Answering my own question: I think it fair. I do want more people in Agramon. And if not more, I want them to be even for each realm, be it in amount, skill, level or equipment. Oh, and if you didn't recognise it yet; you are but focusing on who is worse, adders or anti-adders now. Please stay on topic. Seriously, guys. Quotes are not meant to be some kind of who-owns-who game. So please don't start getting subjective, keep it objective. |
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lol i was not talking about myself. Luckily i dont have a problem finding a grp if there is place And if the grp is full, the ppl i always run with, dont mind me or someone else running with them. just face it 
And btw its exactly your attitude wich makes it impossible to get it back to the level it used to be here. |
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and then we have another problem...
the last year, this server got more and more rvr friendly, making ppl level up u-in BG instead of in the mainlands, just have a look at breamar, if you go there with your lvl 30, most of the players con grey.. ok, it is far more fun and a lot faster to lvl in bg.. but what abouth equipment? who has the money to buy an armor that's good enough not to be laughed away in agra? you can get epic, but it's only nice to look at.. it's worthless in rvr.. you can go DR but you can't use the stuff till you are 50 don't you think a lot of lvl 50 players get demotivated cause they have no plats for armor, and they can't find the items they need for their template? droprates have been nerfed a lot, mobs have been made harder to kill, money is hard to get... so making them lvl faster up to 50 is useless if they can't afford to get good equipment while doeing it.. don't forget, the "older" chars who leveld the hard way a few years ago could farm a plat in the same time it takes to farm 100G now, mobs dropped like crazy, moran could be solo'd, kez was neutral, Df princes and bossmobs where easy to farm.. not to mention the numerous bugs who got abused to make tons of money in a few hours... i can't remeber the time i got asked to make equipment for others, as soon as you say what it costs to make decent stuff, most get silent for a bit and say: no thank you... |
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I've mentioned a scheme to equip players with gear so that they can use to level with. If you read my previous posts i linked to my old thread covering a proposition for how to do this. Players can opt to get items in exchange for giving up their privileges to use a bg. This would have the effect of allowing them to save their limited funds they acquire while leveling, and then have that to expend on purchasing a decent set of gear to rvr in. As for money drops, perhaps that can be another scheme for bonuses to encourage play in certain realms and manage the populations of realms a bit better. For example adding a global percentage increase in money acquired from drops and item sellbacks to merchants if your realm is the least populated. |
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Nice idea. Bonus in crafting speed, money gain and drop rates for the most underpopulated realm would be one way to motivate them (ot at least makes it a lot easier) to participate in RvR.
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for lvl 45+ chars maybe.
and it should be for the most under-agramon-populated realm. this is albion, which, btw, has the most players of all 3 realms! albs dont need more motivation in doing braemar rvr. isnt it the usual way in alb to bring the char to lvl50, get a nearly or full capped sc (template made with moras), and mostly do agramon RvR from that point on? it is, in midgard - for the majority of players I know. where is the problem in alb? Is it an equipment problem? - too less people with knowledge of making sc-templates? - is it harder to make good templates in alb, than in hib or mid? - lack of crafters? Or is it a player problem? - not enough leader-persons, who start building groups? - too many players with an annoying attitute that banish new players from agramon? - lack of lvl 50 chars? A communication problem? - no teamwork between guilds? -> forge an alliance of RvR-willing guilds Maybe even a worldbuild problem? - PvM zones are looking so good in Albion, that it is more fun to do PvM than RvR?? |
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well, it's a problem of albion beeing the most difficult realm to build good rvr grps, most chars have ability's, but you need a lot of chars to get a good setup, albion is just a tad different from, let's say midgard.. what mids can do with 5 chars can olny be dome in albion by a fg..
albion has allmost no access to df, i know it's because they lach the power to claim it atm.. resulting in half midgard caarying the new basalt weaps, and only a few albs who have them.. just look at the statistics, midgard getting 50% more rp's then albion, and that has been like that for months now... rp's mean RA's, making chars more powerfull.. and even if you guy's think x-realming should solve some of the inbalace probs, i still dislike it a lot, it's unfair towards the players who still think this game is abouth realm war.. fighting the ennemy realm is not: joining the realm that suits you best at a certain moment.. but that's my opinion.. this game used to be abouth getting your char to emein to fight the ennemy.. now it's all abouth numbers, stats, skills, ra's.. and not knowing if the guy you just helped to lvl his char will be killing you cuz he changed realm as soon as he knew you got some friends together to go to a bg... |
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