Zarkor wrote:PS: Nixian, you just don't get it either do you... You're twisting Amadeth's words around like someone with a reading disability just so you can claim you are right. Amadeth only said he will go there, he didn't say any grp larger than 2 can't come looking for him did he? He didn't say all FGs need to go to Odins, right?
He just said, OK; I'm going there, period.

Please ask ANY GM if it is rvr organization to tell in irc/forums/etc that player XXX will be at position YYY


I will bet that 99% of the time they will say yes that is organizing rvr

(to reference I earlier made a post saying "solos go to the lake in agra" and the post got moved/deleted because it was considered organized rvr)

also I asked Nayru.. just because you don't agree with mine or staffs definition of rvr organizing it doesn't make it wrong - thats just how it is


so. replies like amas = ban

If u ask for "no add", cause of the challenge of the fight and the rps are only a Bonus then ask for a 8vs8 instance without rps and do ur honestly fights with challenge etc.

I hate that some ppl want to tell me how or where i have to play RvR.

Atm 50 RvR is the worst place ever for me, I'm sad that my toons get 50 because everytime u get a pug grp u get rolled by imba 8vs8 grps if u get some help u get flamed cause of zerg cant win only with 8 bla bla bullshit.

Yesterday we saw albs fighting against Rotbart grp and our Leader decide not to "add", albs lost and we were dead 5 min later against the same mid grp w/o 1 kill. Why havent we help the other alb grp and both grps get some points? Now both alb grps are dead w/o points really funny. Some day we started a grp and had 3krps/h because we dont add any fair 8vs8 fight or solos etc, wow really funny to walk around for nothing.

I know why all log out or lvl another BG toon, because they dont want to feed the inbah grps with more rps. If they run with a grp the pugs have no chace, if they take more to get some rps and to have a chance to kill smth they get flamed they destroy RvR but from their point of view, they dont have another chance to get some rps/fun.

Every Medal have two sides!

If u get rolled ever and ever from imbah setup grps, u have only 3 options:

- get more
- log out
- or hit everything u see in the hope it get killed until ur alive for some points.

I can understand both side of the "no add" mentality, but if i ever get flamed to "not add" i search their fight and add how much i can, because they want to tell moe how i should play, so i show them that it doesnt work, and i do what I WANT TO DO not them

LG Jack

nixian wrote:

Zarkor wrote:PS: Nixian, you just don't get it either do you... You're twisting Amadeth's words around like someone with a reading disability just so you can claim you are right. Amadeth only said he will go there, he didn't say any grp larger than 2 can't come looking for him did he? He didn't say all FGs need to go to Odins, right?
He just said, OK; I'm going there, period.

Please ask ANY GM if it is rvr organization to tell in irc/forums/etc that player XXX will be at position YYY


I will bet that 99% of the time they will say yes that is organizing rvr

(to reference I earlier made a post saying "solos go to the lake in agra" and the post got moved/deleted because it was considered organized rvr)

also I asked Nayru.. just because you don't agree with mine or staffs definition of rvr organizing it doesn't make it wrong - thats just how it is


so. replies like amas = ban

LOL, seriously Nixian, I can tell I'm in the Hib frontiers from time x to y. I can tell I'm Odins from time x to y.

What's that information give you? Nothing, because you still don't have a clue were exactly I am.

So even if that would in a violation in its strictest form, I highly doubt u'll get banned for it. Besides, he never said a date and time; so you kinda fail by exaggerating.

nixian wrote:

Zarkor wrote:PS: Nixian, you just don't get it either do you... You're twisting Amadeth's words around like someone with a reading disability just so you can claim you are right. Amadeth only said he will go there, he didn't say any grp larger than 2 can't come looking for him did he? He didn't say all FGs need to go to Odins, right?
He just said, OK; I'm going there, period.

Please ask ANY GM if it is rvr organization to tell in irc/forums/etc that player XXX will be at position YYY


I will bet that 99% of the time they will say yes that is organizing rvr

(to reference I earlier made a post saying "solos go to the lake in agra" and the post got moved/deleted because it was considered organized rvr)

also I asked Nayru.. just because you don't agree with mine or staffs definition of rvr organizing it doesn't make it wrong - thats just how it is


so. replies like amas = ban

I'll log in today at 6 pm GMT and will be in Camelot crafting for half an hour or so. after that I'll go RvR in Emain. ****** yeah!
hope people show up!

yeah, well, I'm ready for ban. see you all in a couple of days!

Meh stupid discussion. I prefer clean 8v8 fights myself but I'm not gonna whine at people for adding my fights, even if it annoys me, because it won't change anything anyway.
People raging over broad going all 'omfg you retard don't add' I don't rate very highly.
Besides I'd rather have people zerging and adding in RvR than not RvRing at all. Beats running around in agra for 1 hour and meeting literally nothing.

Live and let live etc..

Heres a good video dealing with adds or just taking on more than 8. LARFO playing their Mids. They were on Alb Palomides where I played but they were in a league of their own (Mids and Hibs were on different servers but dont remember which). IMHO the best 8v8, 8v~, 8v anything (PvE/PvP) the game saw in its early days before and after NF. They wouldnt join zergs but would actually sit on the sidelines and I have a ss but cant get it to work on here (bad forum skills haha). If you want the 8v8 do it but if you dont want to fight against more than 8 get better so you can haha!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IkSmkTicQ8g

Zarkor and Amadeth

I am soooo sorry I am letting you know what Nayru told me

So sorry for trying to help out and let players know when they are getting close to the line so they can pull back and avoid a ban

Sorry for being such a horrible person wanting to see players avoid bans when they easy could

nixian wrote:Zarkor and Amadeth

I am soooo sorry I am letting you know what Nayru told me

So sorry for trying to help out and let players know when they are getting close to the line so they can pull back and avoid a ban

Sorry for being such a horrible person wanting to see players avoid bans when they easy could

You just can't grasp the fact that we don't set a specifc time and place, but rather speak in general to improve RvR.

Why do you always have to hunt the ban side of the topic?

Zarkor wrote:

nixian wrote:Zarkor and Amadeth

I am soooo sorry I am letting you know what Nayru told me

So sorry for trying to help out and let players know when they are getting close to the line so they can pull back and avoid a ban

Sorry for being such a horrible person wanting to see players avoid bans when they easy could

You just can't grasp the fact that we don't set a specifc time and place, but rather speak in general to improve RvR.

Why do you always have to hunt the ban side of the topic?

And you don't seem to grasp that I already told you that what I talked with nayru about wasn't specifying when but only where and he told me to warn players from taking such initiatives?


Concrete talk with Nayru:

Hey Nayru, if players set up an irc channel that stated: "OG is solo zone, Emain is zerg zone, Odins is 8v8 zone" as topic would that be allowed or should I warn them about doing such things?

Nayru: Warn them


isn't that PRETTY similar to someone stating on the forums "I go to xxx zone"?

It's similar but still has a completely different impact and consequence. We never talked about such a thing, Amadeth just said what he planned to do in general, that's where it ends untill you came along talking about specifics in IRC.

We also know we can't talk about that too specificly, but you did because you thought we were close to crossing the line. Thanks for warning us about something we already knew though, I guess it can't hurt to press our noses onto that line so we Definately know where it is...

holsten-knight wrote:8vs8 is definatly fun, but not the only way to have fun!

And please stop pretending 8vs8 is the only challenging way of rvr, and 8vs8 players are the top of elite while all others are so noob.... in fact 8vs8 is really simple compered to lead and be part of a zerg against other zergs with advanced tactics and stuff

What u need for 8vs8? A fotm grp setup, all players rr5+, teamspeak, one to give the orders and a week of playing togehter... it is that simple, as long as everyone is the grp has a basic knowledge about daoc. With this the roxxor pvp can start.
Give me any 7 unknown to me rr5+ players with classes of my choice and a week of time and you will have one more of these "best" 8vs8 grps on the server.

this betrays a complete lack of experience when it comes to 8v8. if you look at the history of 8v8 on live you will see a long tradition of 1-2 dominant groups per server/cluster, and dozens of subpar groups who simply cannot compete. these dominant groups have ranged from r10+ supergroups to low RR guilds rerolling on a different server and still winning. you can find this in the early 8man community on lamorak (trip), you can see it in gareth's 8v8 peak (brute force), you can see it in both mordred 8v8 revivals (the best of blue server 8mans flocked to mordred and only a few like Elysium were able to compete with established guilds like Wrath/FD). you can see the dominance of certain 8mans back in live OF. the point is that DAOC has a strong difficulty curve, and many are not able to hack it. these are all situations where you have -hundreds- of players who are all seeking to be the best 8man on a server, and yet you only wind up with a handful of top groups.

it is not nearly as simple as 'assemble r5 players in teamspeak.' a strong 8man requires 8 individually strong players who can communicate well and play cohesively with each other. and when you pit two of these groups together and a 10 min fight ensues.. those of us who know that experience understand why 8v8 is the true endgame of DAOC for competitive players, and why 'casual' RVR like zergs and keep taking will never fulfill someone who's enjoyed that experience.

i am talking about the kinds of fights that last forever and go back and forth between evenly skilled players, where every action counts and you don't know who's going to win until it's over. the fights you watch on fraps over and over again.. there is a beauty and an art to these battles that will never be found in zerg warfare, and for this beauty i happily reject the idea of RVR 'war.' zerg warfare is boring, keep taking is boring, and what's more i often find many of these 'for the realm' players boring and insipid.

call me elitist, but i guarantee you the average player who seeks 8v8 gets more satisfaction and adrenaline out of DAOC than those players who stand inside or outside of a keep all day and build rams. and don't we play games for the thrills? so enjoy your red is dead mentality and RVR, and enjoy fighting battles where the outcome is decided largely by numbers and circumstance. i will enjoy defeating my enemies in a fair fight, fist over fist, by the merit of sheer skill-- strategy, snap judgments, and cohesion. my victories will taste a hundred times better, and my losses hurt a hundred times worse.

dyukanon wrote:

holsten-knight wrote:8vs8 is definatly fun, but not the only way to have fun!

And please stop pretending 8vs8 is the only challenging way of rvr, and 8vs8 players are the top of elite while all others are so noob.... in fact 8vs8 is really simple compered to lead and be part of a zerg against other zergs with advanced tactics and stuff

What u need for 8vs8? A fotm grp setup, all players rr5+, teamspeak, one to give the orders and a week of playing togehter... it is that simple, as long as everyone is the grp has a basic knowledge about daoc. With this the roxxor pvp can start.
Give me any 7 unknown to me rr5+ players with classes of my choice and a week of time and you will have one more of these "best" 8vs8 grps on the server.

this betrays a complete lack of experience when it comes to 8v8. if you look at the history of 8v8 on live you will see a long tradition of 1-2 dominant groups per server/cluster, and dozens of subpar groups who simply cannot compete. these dominant groups have ranged from r10+ supergroups to low RR guilds rerolling on a different server and still winning. you can find this in the early 8man community on lamorak (trip), you can see it in gareth's 8v8 peak (brute force), you can see it in both mordred 8v8 revivals (the best of blue server 8mans flocked to mordred and only a few like Elysium were able to compete with established guilds like Wrath/FD). you can see the dominance of certain 8mans back in live OF. the point is that DAOC has a strong difficulty curve, and many are not able to hack it. these are all situations where you have -hundreds- of players who are all seeking to be the best 8man on a server, and yet you only wind up with a handful of top groups.

it is not nearly as simple as 'assemble r5 players in teamspeak.' a strong 8man requires 8 individually strong players who can communicate well and play cohesively with each other. and when you pit two of these groups together and a 10 min fight ensues.. those of us who know that experience understand why 8v8 is the true endgame of DAOC for competitive players, and why 'casual' RVR like zergs and keep taking will never fulfill someone who's enjoyed that experience.

i am talking about the kinds of fights that last forever and go back and forth between evenly skilled players, where every action counts and you don't know who's going to win until it's over. the fights you watch on fraps over and over again.. there is a beauty and an art to these battles that will never be found in zerg warfare, and for this beauty i happily reject the idea of RVR 'war.' zerg warfare is boring, keep taking is boring, and what's more i often find many of these 'for the realm' players boring and insipid.

call me elitist, but i guarantee you the average player who seeks 8v8 gets more satisfaction and adrenaline out of DAOC than those players who stand inside or outside of a keep all day and build rams. and don't we play games for the thrills? so enjoy your red is dead mentality and RVR, and enjoy fighting battles where the outcome is decided largely by numbers and circumstance. i will enjoy defeating my enemies in a fair fight, fist over fist, by the merit of sheer skill-- strategy, snap judgments, and cohesion. my victories will taste a hundred times better, and my losses hurt a hundred times worse.

Very well put mate, I'm afraid most people who claim this is not 'how the game is ment to be played' have never witnessed such fights themselves due to the wrong circumstances.

+1 at what dyukanon said. You can't put it in words better than that.

+1 from me too

I ve read what u guys talked about.. on my Excalibur server when i played oficial .. Emain was the zergy place, odin the zone for nice 8 vs 8 fights and hadrian for solo, no1 agreed on it.. it simply got to be like that , but!..there were 2200 players at primetime on the server.. good guild grps were wining over zergs in emain like garabanoch and domain 's grp most of em were 10+ , they could kill 3 fg rr4+ at same time using gates and at mill etc.

So.. in adition to what u all said , i d like to say this.. ppl go in emain and fight, if i for instant will get zerged i ll move to Odin and check it out, if no1 there.. i ll log. Solo was nice in Agramon, i must say that were days when in 4 hours i could make around 40k rps if thing were good, 1 vs 1 nice fights etc, in Old frontiers its not posible anymore, as to reach the enemy base i have to cross the zones where fg roam also , so fg is the only way atm if u want to make rps and have some fun ...for me at least as a zerker.
Peace!

well, I spent an evening camping AMG in Odin's while playing Diablo 2 on my notebook. incs were approximately every 10 minutes which really wasn't that bad as I was hacking through monsters with my hardcore barbarian during downtime. fights were intense and most people were coming back for more. salutations and /bow's all around
think I'll just make this my primary zone

here's some of the screenies:

just as I arrived I found a blademaster camping the gate. quite a fight, RA's flying but she just got the better of me two times



until I decided I could use some help



/afk, time for Diablo


now this guy was quite persistent


Thane; IP2 + WoC for teh win









good times. hope we get some more people over here with time
just not too many