Blue wrote:Don't repeat yourself over and over. Live like NF would be terrible on Uthgard.

But why this resistance against custom changes in OF?
To preserve the "classic feeling"?? pfft there is no such thing and those talking about it are just stuck up ppl that dont play here anymore and probably didnt have more then a RR3L2 merc or something back in the old days on live.

OF needs tuning on this server with this settings, anyone must realise this or be biased as hell. same thing as NF needed custom changes when we had it. And the custom changes cant be as they are now creating imbalance between the realms.

Furthermore the customs changes must encourage ppl to RVR and im not talking about getting more lowbies/xpers out in the frontiers, I talk about real RVR between lvl 50 characters. As it is now i say 5% of the server are RVRing wich isnt much consider this already is a low populated server.

During prime time there is plenty of action.

Sorry people I didn't realize what a touchy subject Nf was on this server so Of is fine of course. With that in mind since ppl want to talk about custom changes to Of something they could do to make it even better then nf is make keeps have a realm wide realm point bounty like 2k for all in the area of taking realm 1k would even be ok just to give people a reason to take keeps as they really don't exist in of since you can just directly attack the relic keeps (make them worth like 4k maybe hehe). Just another idea I wouldn't want to play on any other server so I won't say anything more about the Nf stuff lol. Have a great day everyone!

Edit: People need more reason to go out as a realm rather then a single group.

I don't think NF is inferior and I personally think it would be better for casual RVR but there is no point in asking for it back because that would go against the direction of the server which the GMs are completely set upon (OF and 1.62), make all their work into OF and OF RA's completely pointless, and go against what the majority wants (at least in the poll, but 90% of the people who voted were PVE whor*s anyways).

You have to ask for things from the staff that is actually within reach, otherwise you are just giving them a reason to ignore forum posts. Unfortunately It is really hard to tell what is actually in reach though because I have seen countless and numerous AND (imo) necessary requests go unheard for years (class implementation, bugged evade + block rates, etc. etc.) Nonetheless asking for NF back is definitely not within reach unless OF RA's backfire like crazy and the population plummets.

Jonah wrote:

Blue wrote:Don't repeat yourself over and over. Live like NF would be terrible on Uthgard.

But why this resistance against custom changes in OF?

Interesting what you read out of my one-liner. I did not even talk about OF. It was stated several times that we will work on OF.

Blue wrote:Interesting what you read out of my one-liner. I did not even talk about OF. It was stated several times that we will work on OF.

Wasnt mainly from that line but from other threads there u clearly stated this:

Blue wrote:Its not the zone that is a problem, its more or less the concepts that are behind. The zone itself is layout and graphics, nothing else from that point of view. We lack some new (customized) concepts for OF due to the need to stay original as possible there. In NF we customized it a lot with try & error.

What need do u talk about? I say try getting OF as tempting as possible to get ppl out there must be the main goal with the server. For this needs custamisations and a hell lot of em. We tried OF the original way amd it didnt work, now lets try other ways.

OF is not even near the original way and I told in other threads that we started to work out solutions for OF and sure there will be customization in some form or another. Also please don't forget that its the community itself that makes up the game. We can't patch the community.

Blue wrote:OF is not even near the original way and I told in other threads that we started to work out solutions for OF and sure there will be customization in some form or another. Also please don't forget that its the community itself that makes up the game. We can't patch the community.

You can never blame the community for playing a certain way in any game, it's the game setting that makes people play a certain way. And we can't patch the game setting, but you can! Also we cant patch the staff either.

Panchos wrote:i's the game setting that makes people play a certain way. And we can't patch the game setting, but you can!

+

Panchos wrote:You can never blame the community for playing a certain way in any game, it's the game setting that makes people play a certain way.

Sure I can. What about players who want to play undisturbed 8vs8 or 1vs1 without adding? Maybe they play the wrong game or at wrong locations if they don't want to get added in their fight and complain afterwards if that happens? Who knows. DAoC was designed around defending your realm from invaders with help of your realm mates and not as a guild wars clone, if that doesnt fit for some they may play the wrong game.

Blue wrote:

Panchos wrote:You can never blame the community for playing a certain way in any game, it's the game setting that makes people play a certain way.

Sure I can. What about players who want to play undisturbed 8vs8 or 1vs1 without adding? Maybe they play the wrong game or at wrong locations if they don't want to get added in their fight and complain afterwards if that happens? Who knows. DAoC was designed around defending your realm from invaders with help of your realm mates and not as a guild wars clone, if that doesnt fit for some they may play the wrong game.

You can not blame players for wanting to play DAoC and thus Uthgard they way they want to play it, that''s like selling an entertainment product and saying "you can't use it for this, this and this" (even though that's how it entertains some people the most without putting anyone into any danger). To approach games that way as a developer is just wrong in so many ways.

While creating a game, you aim to create a game that's fun, entertaining, attractive and hopefully interesting on a longterm basis. At least, that's generally the idea behind games. Now if you start to pinpoint in what way it should actually be played, in what way it should actually be entertaining, you're allready making a huge mistake since the playstyle you, as a developer have in mind will most likely be just one of the many. The more you hold on to this idea, the more extreme your views will become when it comes to people with a different view and the more aggressive it will be towards them.

Clearly, this is the case for you. You seem to have a clear view of how DAoC should be played, and therefore not only neglect, but even try to force people out of other playstyles by making them increasingly demotivational and dissatisfactory. In any case, you show a clear disrespect of certain playstyles (and thus indirectly of certain players). Of course, you're not actually implementing all the things you've proposed so far, but you do argue them to be your personal choice for the future, which is practicly the same since you're in one of the most powerful positions here.

What I'm trying to say is, instead of trying to hold on to what you think is the most or only worthy playstyle, think of your players instead of yourself for once. Try to cater to ALL your players, to ALL the playstyles, so that this game does not only become attractive to the few that share your view, but to all who want to enjoy DAoC, be it in the way they prefer, rather than the way they are forced to follow.


That is what I try to do, even though I'm just a player and have almost no reason to really do so, since the more self centric view of 'my playstyle is the best and all others can gtfo' is the easiest to follow (and thus not uncommon on these forums). That is also why I try to point out flaws on all aspects (allthough I focus on RvR), for as much playstyles as possible because I KNOW that the more playstyles become actually attractive and entertaining, the more players will stick around and eventually the more fun this entire server will be for everyone, including me, who obviously also has his particular preferations.




So, yea, Panchos was right to be honest. You can not really blame the community for enjoying a game in a particular way as a developer. If they enjoy playing their game in a specific way that's not violating any rules, they should be allowed to do so and should even be motivated to keep doing so by supporting them. It will benefit almost everyone eventually if done right. The more "masssively multiplayer" there is in a MMORPG, the better the gameplay experience in general. The other way around though, if the people in charge are failing to support certain playstyles which should inherently be viable and/or possible, the community CAN blame them in my opinion. After all, they are the ones responsable for providing such a narrowed down version of the game's potential, and they are the ones who can fix things.

Zarkor you can play daoc the way you want, but you cant force people to play your playstyle or follow "your " rules, daoc was mainly zerg in old days emain OF, thats the way I remember all servers that I play , people played 8 man, sure, but they never make all the noise that some people ( minority ) that do emain 8 vs 8 all day long and blame any noob zerg that want to join the fun does here.

We should think on all the players that left uthgard cause they get 50 and try join emain rvr or any rvr and are zerged, wiped , anything by all the rank 8+ groups roaming , that are allways the same ones and want keep "their" playground clear of noobs, adders, and we losing players, a good amount of them cause of that.

Now tell me what staff should do, keep happy a minority of "elitist" or try get more people in frontiers.

Zarkor wrote:
What I'm trying to say is, instead of trying to hold on to what you think is the most or only worthy playstyle, think of your players instead of yourself for once. Try to cater to ALL your players, to ALL the playstyles, so that this game does not only become attractive to the few that share your view, but to all who want to enjoy DAoC, be it in the way they prefer, rather than the way they are forced to follow.

That

Tho I feel a another censorship coming on.


/salute Zarkor

Blue wrote:

Panchos wrote:You can never blame the community for playing a certain way in any game, it's the game setting that makes people play a certain way.

Sure I can. What about players who want to play undisturbed 8vs8 or 1vs1 without adding? Maybe they play the wrong game or at wrong locations if they don't want to get added in their fight and complain afterwards if that happens? Who knows. DAoC was designed around defending your realm from invaders with help of your realm mates and not as a guild wars clone, if that doesnt fit for some they may play the wrong game.

lol, and who exactly is complaining about this server not being ONLY 8v8? VERY FEW. And these people who complain about adding are not asking for custom server changes to prevent adding because that would be impossible, it is just simple whining. And if any of them are, feel the need to ignore them. 99% of people who 8v8 still want there to be a casual rvr here, which there is not. Therefore, the only thing TO do is 8v8.

You say this game is designed around defending your realm...which doesnt happen here because there is no large scale notification of keeps being taken, and no real reason to defend keeps except to keep Df (because it has no effect on relic guards). So although the LIVE servers were designed for this, THIS server is not.. This server is designed around defending DF.

Your game setting is making people play 8v8. And I assure you if there was some sort of casual RVR than there would be exactly that, casual rvr. There will always be 8v8 because the game has 8 slots in a group and open terrain for fighting other groups, it is as simple as that. If there was a game SETTING to make casual RVR viable than there would be exactly that, casual RVR. But there IS NOT. Except in the BGs, which is why so many just remake their characters and go back to the BGs

Panchos wrote:So although the LIVE servers were designed for this, THIS server is not.. This server is designed around defending DF.

Uthgard still does not match live here, accepted. But if we complete OF to be full blown live like, I bet the play style and "no-add-policy" of some will not change. Perhaps there is a constant 50vs50vs50 fight at AMG required to destroy these structures. But like I said, some want that others not. Most likely the casual wants to hide in Zergs until he reaches sufficient RR but the high skilled player wants "fair" fights without adding by casuals.