I'm curious as to know why didn't you get suspended from the boards yet since you call people names all the time. If you cannot discuss the matter in a civil manner please try to restrain yourself.

Glacius wrote:

Force wrote:

Glacius wrote:

Toblerone wrote:That's an npc. Npc damage reduction is also affected by constitution.

Try doing some REAL tests, then come back and think twice before calling someone else a dumb ass.

VALEWALKER IS MORE RESITANT TO MELEE DMG THEN HERO.


Used BM with 2.7 thrust dmg weapon with low str stats , did 70(-1) max dmg on hero and 68)-1) max dmg on valew, bufed and having whole 75 to str stats the diference would be even bigger, i used a fast weap to get more samples.
Toblerone and Amadeth now that you have proofs maybe you wil STFU . NEXT! bye

Did you even add up and divide out to see which took more average dmg?


You hit the Hero for an average of 55 dmg, you hit the valewalker for an average of 58 dmg.


So like I and many other people have already said, VWs take about the same dmg as Heros (58 versus 55 is WELL within the margin of error for such a small (30 hit) test) when their buffs are up.

Dont calculate average dmg dumbo, you take highest dmg or lowest on both chars, after 50 hits u can see which one is ..max or min. You head is 2 slow..what can i do:P.
Did max dmg on valew 68, and i ve kiled him 3 times to see max dmg, same for hero, got 70 dmg.. that BM didnt had str etc..bufed the diference its even more.
You dont need 1000 hits to see max dmg or min on a target, you dont calculate % to dunno what, 50 hits will be enough.. but what do you know..

average damage is all that matters and the fact that you think all that is important is which ticks off the single highest hit exposes you don't know anything about testing.

Max or min dmg that can be done VS 2 targets shows me the real diference. You can measure avergae dmg but u ll get nothing out of hit, base dmg variates, and maybe when u hit a player he will variate more to + or to - , wount help you one bit.
I have enough experience in testing....

because dmg has variance you need to take the average over a large number of hits to lower the margin of error.



The variance for dmg could be for the Hero 35-75, and you could see 1 hit at 71, and the variance for the valewalker could be 40-80 and could potentially NEVER see a hit above 71 in your testing.


But if you looked at the average damage you could see it eventually. Your test did not have enough hits to determine if VWs take less dmg than Heros, but it SUGGESTS that they take about the same.


If you have a lot of experience with testing you are not showing it.

Glacius wrote:Indeed senseless comparison.. 15 more af..and 0.3 dps make a diference? I almost kiled 2 mincers with 75% hp while one was meleeing me the whole time, 2nd one did ip2 to survive,

hey ,... come on ,.. be honest ,.. how about:
"i almost killed 2minstrel with 100%hp (24% you lost with first shouts and hits) while one was just watching, not doing any harm to me, second used IP to punish me for dismissing the offer to 1vs1,...

( hope you meant your video you seem to be very proud of :-/ )

Glacius wrote:mincer utility is in grp ..solo..he can sos away to save his ass and ip2 to die abit later ..thats about it,for me as a det tank his stun and mezz are laughable.

minstrels utility makes it to the most flexible class in game ! (playstyle, without respecing)

somehow i reached RR6 with my minstrel soloing 95%

really hope to meet you solo, when my buffs +RAs up ,.. det5 zerker with charge are a challenge,...

but im sure with the right inc situation, and a nice red pet , or an ellyl sage ,.... there is a chance ;P

Glacius wrote:I almost kiled 2 mincers with 75% hp while one was meleeing me the whole time, 2nd one did ip2 to survive, mincer utility is in grp ..solo..he can sos away to save his ass and ip2 to die abit later ..thats about it,for me as a det tank his stun and mezz are laughable.

ROFL. If you're referring to us, you did no such thing. We killed you without any problems when we both attacked you, and I think everyone here knows what happened next time. ^^

The hardest melee in my opinion are:
Group minstrels (demezzing, interrupting etc)

Defensive group thanes (slamming, backsnareing, dd interrupting, aoe pet spams)

Offensive offtrain skalds (Rupting everything that's not ccd)


Paladins are slightly harder than most melee classes but easier than the above ones.

Valewalkers are easy.

Force wrote:because dmg has variance you need to take the average over a large number of hits to lower the margin of error.



The variance for dmg could be for the Hero 35-75, and you could see 1 hit at 71, and the variance for the valewalker could be 40-80 and could potentially NEVER see a hit above 71 in your testing.


But if you looked at the average damage you could see it eventually. Your test did not have enough hits to determine if VWs take less dmg than Heros, but it SUGGESTS that they take about the same.


If you have a lot of experience with testing you are not showing it.

I havent showed u the log where each character died 4 times and i could see max hit on each one, i ve put a pic with the dmg on each one just to show the diference, i could make 10000 hits on them again and i will show you that you dont hit valew for more then 68 , and hero for more then 70 . That 2 dmg diference shows that valew can resist better to melee dmg, and higher the dmg will be..higher the diference .

So far you've posted a 30 hit test which suggests Heros and Valewalkers take around the same damage.


That's the only thing you've demonstrated, you are misrepresenting what you've posted, and that doesn't help your cause.



Posting a 30 hit test with average dmg at 55 for the hero 58 for the VW, and max hit at 70 for the Hero 68 for the VW doesn't do anything but SUGGEST the dmg is very similar.


Post a 100+ test, with average dmg >5% for the Hero and you will have a test showing heros get hit harder. Although that would still be thin, as to have any real definitive tests you need to do 500-1K hits in my opinion.


I suggest you read up on probability distribution if you still think a 2% difference in max (with an opposite difference in average) dmg after a 30 hit test means anything;

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Probability_distribution

why 5% ? if i d hit wit ha fully bufed warior 2h maybe u will see a 5% diference, but that will take forever to test cause he hits so slow, i ve put a fast 1h weapon cause u get results faster, you think that its the 1st time i post my result here on this forum? i dont have to proof anything to you.

nubrin wrote:hey ,... come on ,.. be honest ,.. how about:
"i almost killed 2minstrel with 100%hp (24% you lost with first shouts and hits) while one was just watching, not doing any harm to me, second used IP to punish me for dismissing the offer to 1vs1,...

( hope you meant your video you seem to be very proud of :-/ )

They atacked me before that fight 5 min earlier where i atacked one, he ran i jumped on the other and in the end both kiled me:).
In second fight Amadeth stuned and DD me i had to keep charge RA for laterz until i reach second player because i knew that if i go for Amadeth he will IP2 like a pusy and i might not kill any1 of em, other mincy was rr4 and i went for the prerogative he has no IP ,thus dieing faster, was no 1 vs 1 there after they both kiled me 5 min earlier

Assist leader.

Glacius wrote:why 5% ? if i d hit wit ha fully bufed warior 2h maybe u will see a 5% diference, but that will take forever to test cause he hits so slow, i ve put a fast 1h weapon cause u get results faster, you think that its the 1st time i post my result here on this forum? i dont have to proof anything to you.

Why 5%? because in order to demonstrate a difference less than that you are going to need HUGE amounts of hits to get the confidence level of the extremely tight confidence interval you will need. I suggest reading more about probability.


I also don't see why you are assuming that scaling up the damage would change the % difference in dmg mitigation of the two classes.




You are the one making claims and then posting screenshots which totally contradict those claims. I am simply checking your math (which you actually didnt even do lol) and pointing out the most obvious of the errors.

Force wrote:

Glacius wrote:why 5% ? if i d hit wit ha fully bufed warior 2h maybe u will see a 5% diference, but that will take forever to test cause he hits so slow, i ve put a fast 1h weapon cause u get results faster, you think that its the 1st time i post my result here on this forum? i dont have to proof anything to you.

Why 5%? because in order to demonstrate a difference less than that you are going to need HUGE amounts of hits to get the confidence level of the extremely tight confidence interval you will need. I suggest reading more about probability.


I also don't see why you are assuming that scaling up the damage would change the % difference in dmg mitigation of the two classes.




You are the one making claims and then posting screenshots which totally contradict those claims. I am simply checking your math (which you actually didnt even do lol) and pointing out the most obvious of the errors.

We dont test how much chances a savage has to quad or crit, or the probability for a merc to hit with both hands, for those u need many hits, we r testing to see max dmg done upon a target based on the fact that melee dmg in daoc even with 21+50 spec in pierce how that BM i ve used is, still variates , its not about probability and maths at 1 point u will see that a certain amount of dmg is the max you can do and it will repeat over and over, its about knowledge in daoc wich you dont have my friend.
Just for you because u r so stuburn i will get logs after hiting each of those 2, so u can be satisfied.

Glacius wrote:We will hunt your ass and kill any mincer inf scout again again and again .

Glacius wrote:To help u comparate the dmg VS a minstrel u dumbo.

Glacius wrote:cause of those like you bugs dont get solved on this server, you gotta fuk up everything..

Glacius wrote:if u dont believe me go test it yourselfes, hope next time u will stfu

Glacius wrote:An npc set to lvl 50 u idiot,

Glacius wrote:you on the other hand play on same realm with me and act like a complete idiot

Glacius wrote:Dont calculate average dmg dumbo

Any reason he's still allowed to post ? What do I have to do to be able to freely flame people like this ? ^^