Correlation does not imply causation...the spring weather is here, etc.

I also personally like the change, and it goes along with the server mission...but I know that I'm definitely in the minority on that one.

Bring on the flames

Kalbren wrote:Looking at https://unixgeek.com/uthgard.html and from anecdotal conversations with friends and /as this change has negatively impacted the server pop.

You can't really link such a fix to server population changes. Its not that the world ends that you can't see Midgard kill messages in Hibernia. This global kill message spam was in there by faulty code. Some like it some do not. In the end we go for the correct implementation.

Trickfinger wrote:Correlation does not imply causation...the spring weather is here, etc.

I also personally like the change, and it goes along with the server mission...but I know that I'm definitely in the minority on that one.

Bring on the flames

Out of curiosity, why you like it? Other question being are you Euro/NA as that matters pretty heavily. I ran with some Euro groups today which was a blast as I woke up early. I had around 10~ or so 8v8 battles against varying groups which is more than I'll get in two NA PST weeknights. We didn't even have to look, we just ran the usual roads and constantly found fights.

Just different strokes for different folks. I'm personally a bit frustrated by it, but I'll live.

Also, yeah, you can't really correlate server pop to that change. It's better to look at trends over time. How many people post on the forums or even pay attention to the bug tracker? I'm willing to bet a surprising number of people are just going to think RvR is more dead lately before realizing the range of spam was altered.

Budikah wrote:I'm willing to bet a surprising number of people are just going to think RvR is more dead lately before realizing the range of spam was altered.

We thought that too before the change. Thats why I propose to show zone info.

There isnt as much an issue with removing the kill spam for EU as there is for NA.

It has been amazing how populated Mid has been with 8 mans, and everyone thought it was such an interesting phenomenon that everyone wasn't just roaming emain.

Well, since the removal of killspam, we have roamed an empty mid twice, without finding another fight and have since been running emain over and over.

Obviously this is just my experience over the past few days with the change, but it is sad to see such a cool feature go. We often would hop between the realms to get fights because we knew there was action (similar to the way crossed swords in new frontiers worked). Now we sit in emain every night =/

You know what was also a part of 1.65? Staff that listened to player input, cared about pop retention(even if the reason was their own salary) and made QoL changes, people looking forward to those changes etc. The times of 1.65 was a transitional time period, never a stand alone thing of it's own. There are ways to measure what people really want, it's called polls. Without catering to the majority, it's likely that the 7 people who confirmed the all zone kill spam will be the entire population of this server sooner rather than later.
But yeah, this put a dent in NA time action, and pretty much removed any late NA action. You can't get reports from people in other zones if there aren't any people.

This is brutal on NA time man, feels like a ghost town out there

the removal of spam msgs immediately made the frontiers feel emptier.

if you added the idiotic crafting material change to encourage action in all rvr zones, you've just undone all that with this kill spam change. ppl used to go gank in Sauvage or uppland and you'd see spam and if emain was zergy you knew you had other options. now everyone actively rvring will be in hib, and you'll have grps outside Sauvage eventually just suiciding to emain instead of waiting for action. (no one will know they are there and no one rvrs in alb frontier-especially now.) in fact I think this might just kill other zones rvr to the extent that albs forming grps will just form the grps at the portal keep in Emain.

Pwncakes wrote:You know what was also a part of 1.65? Staff that listened to player input, cared about pop retention(even if the reason was their own salary) and made QoL changes, people looking forward to those changes etc. The times of 1.65 was a transitional time period, never a stand alone thing of it's own. There are ways to measure what people really want, it's called polls. Without catering to the majority, it's likely that the 7 people who confirmed the all zone kill spam will be the entire population of this server sooner rather than later.
But yeah, this put a dent in NA time action, and pretty much removed any late NA action. You can't get reports from people in other zones if there aren't any people.

And do know what was also part of 1.65? It was 13 bucks a month....

So we all have to accept its not the main goal to have maximum fun for the players, we are just ( addicted ) mice in a cage, observed by more or less interesstet scientists. But hey: u can always leave the cage and wander in the cold and dark outside world.

Gesendet von meinem GT-I9195 mit Tapatalk

The GMS as a whole just need to step back and think about the future of the server and what harm small changes like this will cause.

I want to play Uthgard til i'm 65, minimum.

Mancav3 wrote:The GMS as a whole just need to step back and think about the future of the server and what harm small changes like this will cause.

I want to play Uthgard til i'm 65, minimum.

I 100% agree.

I am not sure where the "have to be 1.65 or nothing" mentality is coming from. Why is that the primary goal? Why is that goal more important than creating a fun experience? Why is that more important than QoL features that will help player retention?

1.65 should be the framework, not the end goal.

The cross frontier kill spam seemed to be a quick and easy fix to the lack of graphical indicators that occurred in New Frontiers. You don't need that when you have the cross frontier kill spam occurring. I think it was a bad idea to fix it.

I honestly was a bit confused when I first got out into RvR and was seeing all this massive kill spam thinking...damn where is all this happening, must be close by. Since I remember back long ago when the kill spam was just in the current zone you were in.

That's beside the point though. The point is, I think the "bug" didn't go far enough. I'd prefer the "bug" to be re-implemented with a "feature".

Billybob was just killed by Johnnyjoe in Forest Sauvage!

While I sit in Uppland LFG, of course. Make it happen cap'in!

Wellzy wrote:1.65 should be the framework, not the end goal.

This is exactly the mentality the devs SHOULD have (or at least this would be my mentality if I were a dev). Why would a developer team ever have this the other way around, I can only speculate.

Blue wrote:

Kalbren wrote:Looking at https://unixgeek.com/uthgard.html and from anecdotal conversations with friends and /as this change has negatively impacted the server pop.

You can't really link such a fix to server population changes. Its not that the world ends that you can't see Midgard kill messages in Hibernia. This global kill message spam was in there by faulty code. Some like it some do not. In the end we go for the correct implementation.

I will have to respectfully disagree with you. Please take my message in its entirety instead of picking one piece and disproving it. Sure, there MAY not be correlation in the drastic pop change after the change. Speaking as a person who has played many hours, daily, since the server launch and who has been in RVR in most of my time, I can say after the spam change went in the frontiers have been VERY empty. This has directly resulted in people logging off instead of trying to find a fight, which just makes the problem worse as more people will stop playing since there's little action.

I saw you ask in another thread how the X-realm spams showed where people were. The way is that if the person who died was not anon, you could /who them and see. Or you could send them a tell and find out who there was and where they were to go fight.

I would strongly encourage you to please reconsider this change as I am afraid it will only accelerate the player pop decline in NA time zones.

Early DAOC was definitely the zone the kill happens in and any adjacent zones. I vividly remember seeing Uppland kill spam while running around in Mularn.