Ranger is OP that is true, but i cant see why that's the vault of pd.

What have a normal buffed Ranger? 1250 life? Maybe more.

1250 * 1,28 (pd5) = 1600 theoretical life (against pur melee)
1250 + 400 (Thoughness 5) = 1650 effective life

Poison is not affected by pd right? And that is a maindamage source of Assassins. Most hybrids have a Magic-Damage Source.
IP heals % not fix life. So do healpots.

The only thing pd > toughness is with a heal class in group


Can you show me my fault? Or why all cry about pd.

Guts wrote:Ranger is OP that is true, but i cant see why that's the vault of pd.

Yeah, PD isn't the real problem with the class. High RR Rangers put points into Toughness and PD. Ronia has almost 2000hp with buffs and 50% melee damage resist with PD (+ IP2 good luck). If you took away PD then those points would be spent on MOS 5 and MoP and whatever else. Then you'd have Celts with 2000hp crit-shotting you out of stealth like Tzaaa and then owning you with MoP/Aug Str.

Pick your poison.

The problem with Rangers has always been their melee damage.

if you would playing in DF as a sb as i do regularly, you could see that on the level groups there more rangers leveling than any other class in hib. this hasn't changed for months now.

i like to see rangers nerfed (i could list several reasons), but this would thin out hib even more and that wouldn't be good. you just can't nerf the absolute and only fotm class in the underdog realm (as hib is perceived by many).

btw: judging from thid in the last week, there a lot more ranger adders inc to emain. 1 of 20+ fought me solo.

The ranger may be one of the stronger stealth classes but infact the nightshade is the weakst assassin in the stealth war. Therefore it is not very surprising, why the ranger is preferred over the nightshade.

For explaination:

1. Nightshades can only be Lurikeen or Elves, which have both only 40 con. Norse shadowblades in comparsion will have at level 50 about 200+ hp more than a lurikeen/elf nigthshade.

2. Elf/luri nightshade have a very low strenght, but a high dex. Problem here is that albion and midgard leather is resistent against thrust. So as nightshade you have to choose to hit against 35%+ melee resis or use blades with low strenght.

As balance for lack con/strenght or 2.5 speccpoints nightshades receive some gimp insta-dd/dot, which even do lesser damage then a regular dot-tick and is on 15+ sec recast. Some fights against other assassins last not even long enough to use the instas twice ... I only found the insta-dds usefull for rupting. But number of encounters where the insta-dd/cast-dd is an real advantage for the nightshade are few.

I think, the world would already look different, when Shars would be able to start as nightshade ...

PS: The melee-damage of a ranger is far inferior of the melee damage of an assassin. Assassins have a very good high grow-rate anytime-combination with garrotte and follow up, as well the best after-evade chain. Ranger only can compansate this by speccing high celtic dual in combination with damage add and of coruse the self buffs.

You're only wrong in 1 thing, NS is the most powerful assassin on uthgard. True they always were weakest on live, but that's not the case here.

Garad wrote:PS: The melee-damage of a ranger is far inferior of the melee damage of an assassin. Assassins have a very good high grow-rate anytime-combination with garrotte and follow up, as well the best after-evade chain. Ranger only can compansate this by speccing high celtic dual in combination with damage add and of coruse the self buffs.

Far inferior? You have obviously never had to fight a Ranger. Better style growth with garrote does not compare to a STR and Damage Add buff combined with Shar stats. Combine this with all the other abilities available to the class (speed shout, camouflage, MoS, the best bow damage in the game ) and you get Ranger Rage.

Why are ns the best assasin here?

Cause they can run duo with rangers or what?

Thalien wrote:Why are ns the best assasin here?

Cause they can run duo with rangers or what?

I fear NS more than any assassin. Their insta-DD is very annoying. Infiltrators are easy unless I make a mistake. Same for Shadowblades.

Any complains about melee rangers? Read my sig...

Toblerone wrote:You're only wrong in 1 thing, NS is the most powerful assassin on uthgard. True they always were weakest on live, but that's not the case here.

Reason?

I played a nightshade on a live non-ToA (classic) server up to RR8+, which game setting style is not so far away compared to uthgard.

Nightshades were used to be the strongest assassin class, when they uniquely had remedy and avoid pain in the old RA system. But since this is not true for uthgard, nightshades are the weakst assassin class regarding stealth war.

And on Live ToA, nightshades perform better, than on uthgard (or Live classic) this legendary piercing weapons with heat damage can compete.

Seyha wrote:

Garad wrote:PS: The melee-damage of a ranger is far inferior of the melee damage of an assassin. Assassins have a very good high grow-rate anytime-combination with garrotte and follow up, as well the best after-evade chain. Ranger only can compansate this by speccing high celtic dual in combination with damage add and of coruse the self buffs.

Far inferior? You have obviously never had to fight a Ranger. Better style growth with garrote does not compare to a STR and Damage Add buff combined with Shar stats. Combine this with all the other abilities available to the class (speed shout, camouflage, MoS, the best bow damage in the game ) and you get Ranger Rage.

Assassins and Rangers are on the same damage table. Assassins can have the same stats with potions and charges like rangers. Rangers have their damage add and Assassins have their dot-poisons as well as higher grow-rates with nearly all styles. Assassins do the same or more damage than rangers. Assassins might not do more damage on Rangers than Rangers do on Assassins. But the reason behind this is not the higher damage output of rangers, but the high defense capabilities as: reinf. armor, spec shield, pd and ip.

Thalien wrote:Why are ns the best assasin here?

Because they have the easiest to execute stuns. Can you say any advantage inf/sb have over that ? Of course you don't see that every day because 98% of the players here will only spam garrote/achilles' heal.

Wow, the most senseless qq topic ever in this forums.


First of all, I have 1210 hitpoints like every luri ranger with +10 con spent when creating my toon. Now add 57 const and deduct 118 str/con and wow, a lot of hitpoints left. This thread is really senseless and a lot of qq of ranger specialist, who never played that class on Uthgard. PD is strong vs pure melee classes, but there a lot of better realm abilities I would trade my pd for (just give me parry and moparry, that means a realm defense). In my opinion the strongest melee classes are the merc with slam, parry and fumble abilities and of course the friar.

Additionally, NS is by far the best stealther class on Uthgard and this topic would be created for nightshades, IF nightshades would be the only class with availibility to the current rr5 (which would be livelike with the 1.80 setting). They have bonus to both mid stealthers with blades and dont have to fear the drawback of the very op poison line (120 to 134 damage with viper3 each tick, thats my high mainhand damage vs assassins and the str/con debuff hurts a lot)

On the other hand PA makes too much damage here (see the many topics created by Motaro ). Consequently, it seems that ppl like the high numbers. Critshot has these high numbers, but you shoot every 4+ seconds and compared to an instant pa of 600+ it is just a joke (add crits, poison and debuffs and voila).

PS: Yep, Garad is right. Signed.

Ronian wrote:Wow, the most senseless qq topic ever in this forums.

QQ? The RvR population speaks for itself, Ronian. I can't tell you how many hps your toon has, but I get a general idea when I hit you for 97 (-53) damage and your health bar drops 6%. Maybe you had some extra buffs at the time?

Frankly, I think you are spoiled on your Ranger. You don't know what it's like to play another stealther class, so you just say "QQ " when some one questions it.

Garad,

Everything you say is true and yet my own experience has taught me to avoid a Ranger in melee even more than an assassin. The damage output is roughly the same (with a small advantage to the assassin with Viper 3), but when you combine this with all the other abilities of the Ranger... why roll a Nightshade?

Nope but one of the two expensive 150 mhb charge items. You should try them too

Ronian wrote:Nope but one of the two expensive 150 mhb charge items. You should try them too

The problem with self-buffing charges/pots deserves its own thread.