I keep looking at ranger dmg when i fight them ..what tier are they..? lower then champion for sure..yet they seem to make about the same dmg as a bm .. i know my zerker has a default for melee dmg but still ..i get outdmged by rangers many times and it feels kinda weird.

Any1 with a ranger on uthg wana do 100 hits with a weap VS a certain armour and tell me min and max plz?

MotaroReloaded wrote:Any1 with a ranger on uthg wana do 100 hits with a weap VS a certain armour and tell me min and max plz?

guess no ranger is interest in a (needed) nerv,
but as far as i remember Zacknafein offered some help if test with ranger needed.

Dmg table? Ws? Def penetration? Was ist das? Lets go OF and it will fix itself up...

My Ranger's damage is nowhere near my Blademaster's.

Austerim wrote:My Ranger's damage is nowhere near my Blademaster's.

Its higher?

Braxis wrote:

Austerim wrote:My Ranger's damage is nowhere near my Blademaster's.

Its higher?

Every crybaby seems to think it is but it isn't.

MotaroReloaded wrote:I keep looking at ranger dmg when i fight them ..what tier are they..? lower then champion for sure..yet they seem to make about the same dmg as a bm .. i know my zerker has a default for melee dmg but still ..i get outdmged by rangers many times and it feels kinda weird.

1) Many melee ranger use blade weapons. The armor of your little zerker is slash vulnerable, means blade specced ranger will hit against only 16% melee restistance. On the other hand, your will hit with your slash weapons against 36% melee resistant, even without PD, because ranger reinforced is restistant against slash

2) Melee ranger spec PD. This makes your attacks even hitting for less. Not to forget the self-AF.

3) Many melee ranger choose to be celt or shar (start with 70 str). They have a str self-buffs and most likeley will use a str/con charge (or at least pot). Even though the base str buff is an advantage, as a Troll (which you hopefully had taken as your race for a zerker) you can use str pot and a str/con charge and should even reach higher str values than a ranger with buffs.

4) Ranger have a dmg add, which hit for additional damage. Don't worry, there is a dmg-add charge craftable that do even more dmg than the ranger ones, but last only 30 sec. I use it with my Inf.

5) If you want to win against a melee ranger you should optimize your RAs to MoParry and Purge/IP. A ranger wich don't hit deals no damage.

PS: I will do later 100 hits on a training doll with buffs and without buffs using pierce weapons and melee spec. But I can already tell you that styled I hit rarley more than for 120 dmg with mainhand.

Austerim wrote:

Braxis wrote:

Austerim wrote:My Ranger's damage is nowhere near my Blademaster's.

Its higher?

Every crybaby seems to think it is but it isn't.

And every sane person who plays can see that dmg/ws tables are light years away from being implemented.

Damage tables are implemented.

Trishin wrote:Damage tables are implemented.

May we take a look at them please?

Braxis wrote:

Trishin wrote:Damage tables are implemented.

May we take a look at them please?

Could you please explain what YOU understand under damage tables?

WS base factors:
Ranger 360
Blademaster 440
You can easily see that on how WS scales with stats&spec.

Blue wrote:

Braxis wrote:

Trishin wrote:Damage tables are implemented.

May we take a look at them please?

Could you please explain what YOU understand under damage tables?

WS base factors:
Ranger 360
Blademaster 440
You can easily see that on how WS scales with stats&spec.

Yes but i want to see the unstyled dmg Blue , if it fits the right way .

Garad wrote:

MotaroReloaded wrote:I keep looking at ranger dmg when i fight them ..what tier are they..? lower then champion for sure..yet they seem to make about the same dmg as a bm .. i know my zerker has a default for melee dmg but still ..i get outdmged by rangers many times and it feels kinda weird.

1) Many melee ranger use blade weapons. The armor of your little zerker is slash vulnerable, means blade specced ranger will hit against only 16% melee restistance. On the other hand, your will hit with your slash weapons against 36% melee resistant, even without PD, because ranger reinforced is restistant against slash

2) Melee ranger spec PD. This makes your attacks even hitting for less. Not to forget the self-AF.

3) Many melee ranger choose to be celt or shar (start with 70 str). They have a str self-buffs and most likeley will use a str/con charge (or at least pot). Even though the base str buff is an advantage, as a Troll (which you hopefully had taken as your race for a zerker) you can use str pot and a str/con charge and should even reach higher str values than a ranger with buffs.

4) Ranger have a dmg add, which hit for additional damage. Don't worry, there is a dmg-add charge craftable that do even more dmg than the ranger ones, but last only 30 sec. I use it with my Inf.

5) If you want to win against a melee ranger you should optimize your RAs to MoParry and Purge/IP. A ranger wich don't hit deals no damage.

PS: I will do later 100 hits on a training doll with buffs and without buffs using pierce weapons and melee spec. But I can already tell you that styled I hit rarley more than for 120 dmg with mainhand.

Do you think that i dont know the fact that my armour is weak to slash dmg? my zerker is double spec..thus i can hit with crush if i want VS hib reinforced because its weak to crush dmg..and thats what i do .. but u dont know any of these cause you find your self talking about PD and bla bla ..no matter what the dmg is ..you will add both dmg and resist(-???) from brackets to check out the actual dmg. I have fought before other rangers like Syuveil , Add and no way i can reach their dmg with a troll and hiting as fast as they do. ..
And hits VS dolls are irelevant , i need 100 hits unstyled using only 1 mainh weapon preferable lvl 51 , 100 qual /cond doesnt matter if its slash thrust , teling your str, dext,quic stats , composite spec , WS , and 1 hit styled with taunt style VS a lvl 50 player with 100 qual /cond armours lvl 51 armours preferable leather or reinforced type as VS chain the numbers tend to shrink too much and you cant see well the diference .




And nightshades , sbs, infs are not far either from having a melee dmg bit hard for their tier ..this is a post i ve put some time ago.

I ve fought Seppel rr8L8 nightshade the other day and he hited me with garrote for 188(-44) mainh using a 4.2 mainh weapon slash dmg and 2.5 offh slash weap VS studded mid. Now i can only asume that he was using bufs as: str/con, base str to increase his dmg and dext/quic ,perhaps haste..not sure .

Picture with his dmg:




I went on live after that and created a NS with this spec: 50+16 crit strike, 51 composite blades, i bufed him with +80str ( asuming Seppel used best str/con 56 + 20 base str from pots=76 str) and i also took augm str3 RA asuming seppel has augm str .

I did some unstyled hits on a target beeing a: blademaster all armours lvl 51 100% qual /cond having 19% slash resist same as i have on uthgard with my zerker ( actually i have 29% but-10%=19% slash)

Pic with ns base dmg hits from pendragon:
Max base dmg he did= 108(-25) 133
Min base dmg he did= 78(-18) 96




These r the garrote hits from live with 4.1 mainh and 2.7 offh :


The spec and bufs this ns from live has are maximal in my opinion , and from 188(44) dmg done on uthg to 151(-35) is a long way . I dont even know is Seppel had a haste buff, cause if he had his style dmg should have been even lower and thus all of his dmg lower .

This is a log where i have fought a blademaster with 20 seconds before Seppel's fight which is on this log also , and BM had base str ,str/con bufs and weapons 4.2 spd mainh and 3.1 spd offh.

Log here to downl bm and ns fights : http://www.mediafire.com/?mm5jwmzjhwy
Highest dmg bm did on me was 151 and he a s a celt race with higher str then a ns and on a superior dmg table , using an anytimer with growth around 0.58% at least, garrote having 0.75% . It seems funny to me that a lurikeen ns hits harder then a celt bm.

A few calculation regarding the NS above:


.Style dmg = ((Growth Rate * Weapon Spec) * Effective Speed) / Unstyled Damage Cap

Effective Speed = SPD * ( 1 – ( Quickness – 60 ) / 500) ) * ( 1 – Haste%)
Unstyled dmg cap = hit a lvl 1 mob
Growth rate of the style.

Lets see for our NS on pendragon.
eff speed= 4.1 x( 1-(258-60)/500)x 1
eff speed= 2.4764
unstyled dmg cap= 215
garrote growth=0.75
Style dmg= ((0.75 x 66) x 2.4764)/215
style dmg = 0.57014
57% should add to our ns's base dmg resulting final dmg.

Lets see a garrote hit i ve done on live, 140(-33)with +63 style dmg.
140+33 = 173 whole dmg - 63 style dmg = 110 base dmg
63/110 = 0.5727272 , it seems that live dmg was correct.

Now lets see the uthgard hit 188(-44) = 232 dmg Seppel did.

- looking at the log i fight he hited me unstyled for 99 dmg with his mainh weapon :
[00:33:15] Your melee buffer absorbs 57 damage!
[00:33:15] Seppel hits your leg with his Grim Blade for 42 damage!
- i will take 99 dmg done on me, i ll add the 19% slash resist and we get 122 base dmg , and 110 style dmg.
- 232 full dmg / 232-110 = 1.90 , which means style dmg for Seppel was 0.90 % using the base dmg i randomly got from him, but the base dmg could have been higher etc.

I can asume a few posibilities:
- if 122 dmg is the base dmg he had for that hit , 0.90 style dmg is wrong when it should have been around 0.57% , why is his syled dmg so high??

- i still dont know if he used haste alongisde with dext/quic buffs , if he used haste , he will have same unstyled dmg 122 but his style dmg will be even lower then 0.57% .

Did you even consider that Hibernia has ALL relics??

Blue wrote:Did you even consider that Hibernia has ALL relics??

Its not only this week that i have seen the diff Blue , you have data there spreaded in 2 years , i havent done any exact calculations on the dmg i ve seen these days , but there is a real problem either with base dmg or with style dmg.

The hits taken from that NS Seppel are like 3 years ago when he wasnt even rr7 , and that style dmg of his for example is out of the charts beeing 0.90% when should have been 0.57% or even lower if he had haste bufs.

I can add or substract 10% from the dmg , but i need 100 hits unstyled under certain circumstances and 1 hit styled .. i wonder if some1 will do it.

Garrote: 0.75 growth rate.
Hamstring: 1.15 growth rate.

1.15/0.75 = 1.53, so you should expect an 53% increase in style damage from Garrote to Hamstring. Taking the ~65 style dmg from your screenshot of pendragon, this would be 35 additionald dmg before resists, so ~30 extra dmg after resists.

So you see, your numbers are perfectly fine.