then what DOES influence defense penetration?

are you saying that if someone has capped block chance at 75%, nothing can lower it? that would mean someone with 1 in Slashing skill would have the same chances of penetrating evade/parry/block as someone with 50 slashing. same goes for being unbuffed vs. being buffed.

this is definitely not livelike, but I do not believe this is the case on Uthgard either...

maybe you should consider that weaponskill itself doesn't change the penetration chance but the things that affect weaponskill does..

No defense on Uthgard takes enemies weapon skill into account. Currently only Evade chances can be lowered by style bonus. Until there is proof that Weaponskills not only improve damage but also improve penetrating enemy defenses, there will be no change to it. And honestly you would have more information in the web about this relation if it would exist. Especially in public available evade/parry/block formulas.

hmm I think I remember some people on VNboards discussing if wyrd spec was not the only way to go any more due to recent discoveries on how defence penetration worked with weaponskill

let me see if I can dig it up

here

http://vnboards.ign.com/midgard_stealth ... 266365/p1/

and followup from that

here

http://vnboards.ign.com/albion_stealthe ... 343/p1/?10

http://www.camelotherald.com/more/3160.shtml

Q) It had been said in a previous Grab Bag that Weaponskill was tricky in that it was not actually used in calculations, but used many of the same variables. This brings me to my question - What exactly IS weaponskill? What is it calculated from, and what similarities and differences does it share with the calculations from damage output?

A) Weaponskill is not actually used in calculations, this is true. It is heuristic, a number derived from a simplified formula that is used to aid you in determining how your damage output will be affected by changes in your character. It can not be used as an exact determination of how effective your damage or defense penetration is, but it will give you a ballpark idea. If you're looking to get in to the nitty gritty of how your character works, it is best to ignore weaponskill and focus on actual damage done.


http://www.camelotherald.com/more/3090.shtml

Q) What affects the rate of hitting someone with your shield with shield styles?

A) The style itself, as well as the level of the user/target affects hit/miss rates. Shield weaponskill derived from stats like dex and shield spec will aid in penetrating block/parry/evade, but will not affect hit/miss rates.


http://www.camelotherald.com/news/news_article.php?t=grabbag&storyid=3835

What determines how weaponskill penetrates defenses?
"Weaponskill on your character's paper doll is essentially an abstraction of a number of different offensive attributes tied into your main weapon line (specialty lines, like shield and dual wield, will not be shown on the paper doll, but do have weaponskill values of their own). There is no direct formula for how weaponskill impacts defences, but each of the individual components that makes up weaponskill will impact your ability to penetrate defenses. Generally speaking, the higher your weaponskill, the better your defense penetration."


http://www.camelotherald.com/newfrontiers/realmabilities/index2.php, under the point "Dodger"

"One exception - when that infiltrator is fighting a class with high weapon skill, like a hero or warrior. In this case, the infiltrator's chance to evade is modified downward by the tank's weapon skill."



So there should be some connection, although it's probably complicated

If you read Wyrd's posts from when he was doing testing many years ago, you'll find him commenting about how your weapon spec has a small influence on defense penetration, and your stat related to that weapon has a fairly large influence on defense penetration.


I believe this relationship is demonstrated in the tests nixian posted. In those tests, adding about 20 to spec gains a few % defense penetration, but adding 50 to str gains like 10-20%.

at least we now have enough confirmation that your enemie has a way to impact your own defence rate that means something has to be tested there

Wow, great job Weia and Nixian on finding those! Too bad there is no formula for Blue to work with. Barely even a hint. Mythic.

A dedicated test (1000+ hits to test mobs in parry state) on Pendragon with spec 1 and spec 50 will give more results than speculating here. Parry chances with different weapon stats should be tested too. I doubt Mythic uses their combined weaponskill but rather single components of it.

Blue wrote:...Especially in public available evade/parry/block formulas...

all available formulas for defensive skills that can be found in various character planners or forums are useless, since they don't consider the impact of the attackers offensive skills.

this impact is really huge on life servers, expecially when high str/wf toons like troll warrior, firbolg hero or half ogre arms start speccing mastery of str. high str fulltanks hit targets with pimped defensive skills up to mob 4 very reliable, where low str/wf classes/races don't hit anything vs. mob x shield users.

i don't know if it is str or wf or just a part the wf-formula what mythic uses to calculate defense penetration, but i know for sure that the impact is really big.

Delete please.