Hi staff, i'm playing on midgard so i duno about other realms.
Is dual wielding using an average speed swing of both hands? or only the right hand?

I've tried to figure out if it was working and I have a feeling it doesnt use the average of both hands speed, but it keeps using only the right hand spd totally ignoring the left hand.

I was using two 2.4 speedo weapons so far from my leveling SB zerk, but now I've just bought the DF left handed axe and it is a 3.5 speedo, and using it dosnt seem to make my speedo slower as it should be.

before
Right 2.4 / Left 2.4
after
Right 2.4 / Left 3.5

Could any confirm the formula or try a test, and tell me if it only uses the right hand speedo or an average of both hands when dual wielding?
Thx much appreciated

aenrick wrote:Is dual wielding using an average speed swing of both hands? or only the right hand?

Yes.

aenrick wrote:I was using two 2.4 speedo weapons so far from my leveling SB zerk, but now I've just bought the DF left handed axe and it is a 3.5 speedo, and using it dosnt seem to make my speedo slower as it should be.

before
Right 2.4 / Left 2.4
after
Right 2.4 / Left 3.5

If your swingspeed is 2.4 and you have quickness, maybe even a group buffing you, you will reach the speed cap (limit). Weapons with speed 2.4 and 3.5 used in dual wield will result in a swing speed of 2.95. Adding the enhancements from quickness (and haste buffs) it will also almost reach the speed cap. That's why you don't notice a difference.

Hint: Use a fast lefthand and a slow righthand.

Thx for your theory but you really missed my question and moreover that theory isn't right about cap, in daoc you got the wrong number because speed cap is 1.5 and not 2.4 so there should be a huge difference when i use both 2.4 versus (2.4+3.5)/2= 2.95

according to that calculator
http://www.daocmaps.com/weapon-speed-calculator

both hands 2.4 => 198 qui => 1.7 average
2.4 and 3.5 => 198 qui => 2.5 average

yet i dont see any difference in my styling between 1.7 and 2.5 where it should be quite noticeable. My concern is that it seems the left hand speedo is Ignored by the game.

If any test cud be done i wud apreciate much, thx.

aenrick wrote:yet i dont see any difference in my styling between 1.7 and 2.5 where it should be quite noticeable. My concern is that it seems the left hand speedo is Ignored by the game.

It's definately working mate. Just tested it. Try to pick a slow righthand and fast lefthand and try again to see results more clearly.

yay, ive taken another test and it works. maybe i had too much QUI to see it clearly so i took off all my QUI items and i tested again.

And definitely yes, the both hands speed swing seems being an average of both hands speedo. Voila

All,

I am a little confused with the maths of DW, Haste effect and weapon speeds. Originally I recognized the theory of slow main and fast off to be the way to go. That was also my setup ever since.

According to the theory, when swinging with both hands, the swingspeed is calculated by the average of the two weapons.

So for example 3.3 main + 2.4 off = 2.85

If we now add quickness and haste to it (in this example 231 Quick and 17% haste) we end up at 1.56 total speed (dual wield swing speed considering the haste effect) so not too far away from speedcap (1.5).

BUT! According to the calculator I use it says: "The Dual Wield Swing Speed shows the haste effect one gets when wielding weapons of different speeds. This effect will only take place when the dual wielder swings both weapons at the same time." (source: http://reocities.com/SiliconValley/park ... n_calc.htm)

Now the chance to wield both weapons at the same time is though never 100% but somewhere around 60% for a DW 50 specced char. (source: as above)

This leads me to the conclusion that there is a high chance that you will only hit with the slower main hand when hitting styled (in our example 3.3 = 1.8 with quick and haste) leaving you with too much delay.

So this would support the theory that I hear often these days, that it is better to use two weapons of the same speed.

To Do the math:
2 x 2.9 Long Dirk = 2.9
With Quick 231 and haste 17% = 1,58

If not wielding both (so in 40% of the cases) I will still hit with 1.58 delay making me swing close to speed cap all the time also when not wielding both weaps.

Damage will probably be even at the end of the day but I have much higher chance that weaps proc and that i can apply style effects on enemy.

Does this all make sense or am I missing something?

Thx for your feedback in advance....

Cheers

Guyz? Where are the profis?

I have considered doing the same however your PA dmg will suffer a lot which is why I still run with slow MH and fast OH

The mainhand is the only one styled, and therefore does most the the damage. If you use a 2.9 mainhand you will gimp your damage. The point of having a fast offhand is to hit faster (even if not 100% of the time) while the main damage remains the same.

Also with a 50 DW/CD spec, +11 on sc and RR4 - 5, the chance to hit with both weapons is around 70%.

Hedra wrote:The mainhand is the only one styled, and therefore does most the the damage. If you use a 2.9 mainhand you will gimp your damage. The point of having a fast offhand is to hit faster (even if not 100% of the time) while the main damage remains the same.

Also with a 50 DW/CD spec, +11 on sc and RR4 - 5, the chance to hit with both weapons is around 70%.

Exactly. Going with the slowest mainhand is definately the best choice unless you want to be 'different' and gimped at the same time.

well i can tell you, on my berserker its a noticable difference (4.2mh 4.0oh vs 4.2/2.9). not sure though if there are problems in the code if you get close to capspeed.

also for clarification on the actual swingspeed + haste effect for dual wield + CD vs. leftaxe...

when using 2 weapons in midgard (leftaxe) your offhand swings 100% of the time. your swing speed is (mainhand speed + offhand speed)*hastemod/2 (hastemod containing everything else as quickness, haste etc). your styledamage however is only determined by your effective mainhand speed. (wich leads to a higher dps if your offhand is slower than your mainhand AND youre not alrdy on the speedcap).

in albion and hibernia this only happens if you hit with both weapons. if only your mainhand swings, the attackspeed will be your mainhand speed.

-> if you want to hit at speedcap all the time use fast weapons, if you want some free dps (at the cost of not hitting the speed cap ~50% of your hits) go for slow main and fast offhand.

if you want to calculate the real dps boost have fun with excel and this website: http://www.classesofcamelot.com/other/styles/Styles.htm

Well thx for your input. I have both weaponsetups available now. i will do my testing and see what worx best.
thx

nixian wrote:I have considered doing the same however your PA dmg will suffer a lot which is why I still run with slow MH and fast OH

btw: for PA it would still be a good option to drag the 3.9 with disease or snare on in from the inventory the slot, PA the enemy and drag the 2.9 back in ...

Oxymoron wrote:

nixian wrote:I have considered doing the same however your PA dmg will suffer a lot which is why I still run with slow MH and fast OH

btw: for PA it would still be a good option to drag the 3.9 with disease or snare on in from the inventory the slot, PA the enemy and drag the 2.9 back in ...

Reading a little on the site that JeZe had recommended I ran into the following:

QUOTE:
**************************************************************
5. How do the Assassination styles work?



Assassination styles (BS, BS2, PA) work differently than normal styles. Since these styles can only be used as an opener from stealth, these styles have had the DPS portion coded out and just add a static damage value. This allows for assassins to use fast weapons and still hit hard with their assassination styles. Furthermore, since the assassination styles add a static damage amount, faster weapons actually allow for a higher DPS than slower weapons in this case. Thus, one can debate the benefits of a slow assassination weapon versus a fast one.



Perforate Artery Cap = 75 + Critical Strike Spec * 9 + Nonstyle Cap

Backstab II Cap = 45 + Critical Strike Spec * 6 + Nonstyle Cap

Backstab I Cap = ~5 + Critical Strike Spec * 14 / 3 + Nonstyle Cap
**************************************************************
END QUOTE

Now this would mean that you dont even have to switch weaps for PA. I need to test this too.

Or has anyone tested this already?
THX