Merc Weapon Choice

GreyBjorn
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Postby GreyBjorn » Aug 25, 2017 19:32

Ive seen this 2 post and im a bit confused.
im using this to calculate weapon swing
http://talsyra.tripod.com/daocmechanics ... speed.html

but the statement which u see below gave me an headache. especially Nezix's post
what should u go?

Halp!!!!

Nezix wrote:I think your offhand will depend on whether you have haste up, always access to dex/qui etc. Whenever you attack with both weapons (chance depends on total DW) you will get an averaging of the swing times. Your offhand always hits for base damage, so it would hit harder with a slower weapon but you'd get less of a haste effect. This haste effect doesn't lower the damage on your mainhand though I think so its something to consider.


Caldrian wrote:You usually want a slow weapon (like a Rapier or Gladius) in your right hand as it will do most damage per hit, especially with your crit styles.

You want a fast weapon for your lefty (like a Dirk or Stiletto) the reason for that is swing speed.

Lets assume you use a Gladius 3.7 and a Dirk 2.2. When you only swing your right hand, you will hit every 3.7 seconds (before modification by quickness and haste), but when both weapons swing at the same time, their delay is averaged, meaning the following swing will be in 2.95 seconds, this significantly boosts your dps.
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Requin
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Postby Requin » Aug 28, 2017 09:48

The minimum swing speed is 1.5, with haste you could fall at a swing speed of below 1.5 if you have too quick of a weapon combination, which is why you have to consider having a haste buff in your swing speed calculation and choose weapon accordingly.

You also have to know if you often get targeted by dex/qui debuff, and check your weapon speed with less quickness too.

Also you don't necessarily want to hit the attack speed cap of 1.5, it does benefit your base damage, but reduces your style damage (calculated from main-hand speed):
- If you use mainly styles to CC people (snare, stun) then style damage if not your priority
- If your job is to DPS down target, your style damage will most likely involve high growth rate/High fatigue and thus you will want them to do as much damage as possible, when they do hit.

In the case that you have the RA Mastery of Pain, it is better to go with medium attack speed.
If you want your weapon procs to proc more often then aim for faster attack speed.
If you want to be proccing the defenders' reactives then aim for faster attack speed too ;)

Bubble repops every 3 seconds, so you want your main hand to swing slower than 3seconds, which is almost always the case if under 17% haste at level 50.

In conclusion, to DPS, you should have your main-hand swing speed under 3 seconds, you should have your dual wield swing speed between 1.875 and 2.5 (4 hits or 3 hits during 1 slam, considering a shield delay of 1.5sec).

When you attack your attack delay will be either main-hand delay or dual wield delay or offhand delay.
Example:
Main hand at 4.2 speed; off-hand at 3.2 speed; quickness at 225; haste at 17%; MoA 3%
after calculation:
Main hand delay: 2.27sec; Off-Hand delay: 1.73 sec; Dual Wield Delay: 2 seconds
If you hit with your main-hand you will attack again after a 2.27 sec delay, if you hit only with your offhand after a 1.73sec delay (only possible when hitting unstyled); if you hit with both weapon (60% chances max) you will have a 2sec delay.

In the case that you have both weapon at the same attack speed delay, then you will always have the same attack delay; but you will not benefit from increase DPS due to higher dual wield % => higher attack speed, and as main-and delay is used in style damage calculation; you don't benefit from added DPS due to dual wield.

If you have very low Dual Wield specialization then it would be less of a waste to have 2 weapons with very close attack delays.


Generally, Mercs want to have the slowest available main-hand to them, and calculate the best fit for the offhand accordingly.
While infiltrators will want to have weapons with almost equivalent and fast attack delay as PA style do not benefit from quickness, they usually have low dual wield chance; and they want to lend both their poison quickly.

Finally debuffs:
debuff dex/qui from spell up to 69 points
debuff attack speed from spell up to 19% (Enchanter, Champion, Spiritmaster)
debuff attack speed from style: (3-style-chain from side for BM or 2-style-chain blade for hibernia, 50 Sword style (behind) for MiD, 7% debuff from savage [any])

Buffs:
Theurg Haste is +17%
Strong Elixir of Speed is a 10-min 17% haste buff potion of level 40+
Volatile Celeric Arcanium Weapon Tincture is a 1-min 17% haste proc for weapons
Reactive Celeric Arcanium Armor Tincture is a 1 min 17% haste reactiveproc for armor
Stable Celeric Arcanium Tincture is a 10-min charge-based buff for 17% haste

Realm Abilities:

MoA 1 costs 11 RA points and gives 3% haste and 18 str (mastery of strength 3)
MoA 2 costs 14 RA points and gives 6% haste and 18 str
MoA 3 costs 20 RA points and gives 9% haste and 18 str

MoP 1 costs 5 RA points and gives 5% crit and 12 dex (mastery of dex 2)
MoP 2 costs 8 RA points and gives 10% crit and 12 dex
MoP 3 costs 14 RA points and gives 15% crit and 12 dex

IP costs 23 RA points
Det V costs 22 RA points
Dualist Reflexes 3 costs 10 RA points for 9% increased dual wield % and dual wield damage

Crafted Weapons:
Slash lefty 16.5dps: jambyia(2.6delay), fortified short-sword (2.8 ), exceptional short-sword (3.2)
Crush lefty 16.5dps: Fortified Hammer (2.5), War Mace (3.0), Exceptional Hammer (3.4)
Thrust lefty 16.5dps: Fortified Stiletto (2.4), Long Dirk (2.9), Exceptional Stiletto (3.3)

Slash Main 16.5dps: Fortified Longsword (3.2) Sabre (3.6), Exceptional Longsword (4.0)
Crush Main 16.5dps: Fortified Mace (3.0) Needle Mace (3.4) Exceptional Mace (3.8 )
Thrust Main 16.5dps: Fortified Rapier (3.1) Guarded Rapier (3.5) Exceptional Rapier (3.9)

Looted Weapon 16.5 dps:
Slash: Legion main (4.2), Legion slash lefty (3.2), Golestandt main (3.9) Golestandt lefty (2.7), Golestandt main (3.2), Sidi lefty (3.2=scimitar), Sidi Main (3.7)
Crush: Golestandt main (3.2), Sidi Main (4.4 unsure), Sidi lefty (3.3), Sidi main (3.3)
Thrust: Golestandt main (3.0) Sidi main (3.6) Sidi lefty (3.3), Sidi lefty (2.8 )

So you have to combine a main-hand delay with a left hand delay from this list and then tune your MOA accordingly, be sure not to have your left-hand swinging at less than 1.5 if you don't want to lose unstyled DPS, if you never run of endo its not a problem.

With 200qui (highlander) if you go with something slower than 3.6 for main-hand, you could make use of MoA and if MoA makes your offhand swing faster than 1.5 then you should aim to get a slower off-hand.

Scenarios with optimized off-hand speed:
200 qui with 4.4 main-hand mace and 2.5 off-hand mace, with 17% haste
=> 2.63main/1.49off/2.06dual
220 qui with 4.0 main-hand slash and 2.8 off-hand slash, with 17% haste and MoA 2(6%)
=> 2.12 main/1.49off/1.8dual
220qui with 3.9 main thrust and 2.9 off thrust, with 17% haste and MoA 3 (9%)
=> 2main/1.49 off/1.75 dual

Here its not very good as the dual wield attack speed should be around 1.875 minimum.
Reminder to Self: Quality over Quantity, what is the Value here?

GreyBjorn
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Postby GreyBjorn » Aug 29, 2017 14:05

You are the real MVP
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CowwoC
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Postby CowwoC » Feb 24, 2018 17:23

Requin wrote:Buffs:
Theurg Haste is +17%


+19%


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